An honorable mention!
All entries are based on my experiences and opinions.
Feature article: Former diamond's former blog
thousands upon thousands of tapes.
I stuck my hand in the box and randomly pulled out 4 tapes. I walked over to a tape player and plugged them in one by one. Within seconds of each tape I heard the following clips. Let me state in advance, for the purpose of disclosure, I did not play each tape for more than a few moments to find this information. I can only imagine what I would findif I listened all the way through.
If I am not mistaken, Jerry sits on the IBOAI board. In that position are we to assume that his views are endorsed by Q and his fellow tenured-pins?3. Billy Florence- click here
If I am not mistaken, Fred sits on the IBOAI board. In that position are we to assume that his views are endorsed by Q and his fellowtenured-pins?I thought I would share these statements of the so-called leaders with you. This is the information I received as I worked my way through that business. Based on the feedback I receive...not much has changed.
Oh yea, too all you dummies who think it's a scam or whatever retarded comments you make, I guess Barnes & Noble, Bass Pro Shops, Circuit City, Office Max, Nike, Rebock, Whirlpool, Jockey, KB Toys, etc. Oh wait yea Ace Hardware just joined recently to Quixtar. Perhaps they all thought it was a good idea and not a scam, perhaps they wouldnt tarnish their image on a scam. Yea, I'm sure you dummies know more about business than those about those large corporate businesses. Oh and by the way, I have many other physicians as friends who are profitable in this business. And one more thing to point out, Wal-Mart has 15,000 negative websites and thousands of lawsuits per month. But it looks like you dummies need to post more stuff about Wal-Mart and how evil they are, and how much they scam people and what-not. Yes and it is 50 Cents to make a CD and $8.00 to buy one in the BWW organization. So I guess you morons are too dumb and end up buying music CD's for for $14-$16. Hey it costs 2X as much to buy a non-learning music CD but I dont hear you idiots complain? Oh yea and for those of you who talk about Quixtar being a scam or whatever. I own 2 businesses, a Spine rehab practice and my Quixtar business. And I guess you guys complain because it's fact, you are broke. Plain and simple. Large corporate business like Wal-Mart & Quixtar will continue to make money while you stay broke. Hah I bet none of you complainers own a business. I own a conventional business and a multi-level marketing business so I know both well. I know none of you complainers have the guts to own a conventional business, which is why you cry. Whiners and babies. WAHHHHHH! I can't make money so I have to down a business that does. WAHAAAAH. Seriously, that's exactly what you sound like. Hah you guys make me laugh. Keep posting I love looking at what morons have to say from time to time to relieve my stress from work.
An email interview of Deb (known as gimpymommi in MLM Survivors Club and What About Quixtar), grand daughter of Walter Bass. It is about her family involvement in Amway / Quixtar.
InternetRetailer.com - Daily News for Wednesday,August 17, 2005
For its 2005 fiscal year, which ends Aug. 31, Quixtar expects web sales to be about $748 million, essentially the same e-commerce revenues as 2004. “Sales will be about the same this year,” Brancino says. “But we expect to grow web sales nicely in the 2006 fiscal year.”
Another Entry from Former Diamond's Former Blog
It seems as though little has changed since I was a distributor. I still marvel at the words uttered by the so-called leaders as many attempt to steer their loyal distributors around the truth. They must be exhausted, as Dateline NBC and the Internet have made finding the truth so much easier.
On the one hand, some claim to offer a first-class Internet–based business, while demeaning the Internet itself. Who then are you to believe? They dismiss the Internet as a source of bad information but claim to have the best Internet business on the planet.
As I listen to Greg's advise, he appears steadfast about not reading what…
Toby from Tacoma
Phil from Philadelphia
Valerie from Vancouver
…have to say. He seems to dismiss them as not credible. He seems adamant that you must look to publications like Forbes Magazine and other noteworthy sources of information.
While I disagree with his apparent assertion that the aforementioned individuals have nothing to add to the discussion, for the time being, let’s do what he asks.
Was he referring to Forbes.com from 6/25/01:"
…By joining organizations like Quixtar, you're more likely to fill your shelves with bottles of shampoo than to fill your bank account with cash."
Or this Forbes article from 12/9/91:
"…Known inside Amway as the "Black Hats", these master distributors frequently indulged in excessively high-pressure methods of exploiting their foot soldiers, persuading them to shell out hundreds of dollars each for distributor-produced books, tapes and even unrelated products and investment schemes. The problem: if Amway's distributors make a lot of money from selling such promotional materials (as opposed to actual products) to new recruits, then it again raises questions of an illegal pyramid scheme."
Maybe he was referring to Amway’s own corporate official that wrote in his analysis of two of the largest "training" systems: Click Here
"…Loyalty and dependency is the ultimate objective of the ‘system.’…”
“…So, while friendships are being developed, a dependency is also being created. It is this aspect of their methodology that has allowed for charges of ‘mind control.’…"
"…I think there is little question that is where the big money is made..."
Or the gentleman that is considered in many legal circles to be the "father of the RICO statutes". G. Robert Blakey, who wrote:
"It is my opinion that the Amway business is run in a manner that is parallel to that of major organized crime groups, in particular the Mafia. The structure and function of major organized crime groups, generally consisting of associated enterprises engaging in patterns of legal and illegal activity, was the prototype forming the basis for federal and state racketeering legislation that I have been involved in drafting. The same structure and function, with associated enterprises engaging in patterns of legal and illegal activity, is found in the Amway business." Click Here
Or maybe he was speaking about the co-founder of Amway, Rich DeVos who said: Click Here
"…It is our firm belief that unless we clean up our abuses, we won't have to worry about what's next; we won't be here to worry about it. At this point in our history, we will either take charge of this business and operate it correctly, according to the rules and regulations that the Amway Corporation has given you, or we will not deserve to exist…”
Or maybe he was referring to someone that actually showed 1358 plans in 4.5 years, night after night, went diamond, and sat in the room with senior corporate officials as they divulged their knowledge about the "tool" business...like me.
Maybe, Toby from Tacoma, Phil from Philadelphia and Valerie from Vancouver may have something to add to this discussion...and he is simply exhausted! Just maybe he does not want you to know the truth.
The preceding comments are based on my experiences and opinions.
Winter 2003. We were in training session after open in Radisson Hotel, Toronto. Speaker called a lady. She told that her son swallowed SA8 and she dialed medical help. They assured her that Amway SA8 is safe. If it was TIDE or some other product then the baby had to go to hospital.
Quixtar / Amway boards and Jim Reed go together. In my opinion he's not good for the boards. Here are my observations about him.
People don't fail at amway because they didn't work hard. That's not why they fail. They fail because they joined a pyramid where the average net profit is below zero. They didn't know this, and even when they leave most still don't know it, but as the financial reality catches up with them, one way or another they quit and walk away with their losses. It couldn't be any other way.
I think this needs to be said, and maybe even repeated if people don't want to listen, even if it means being removed from every one of the boards, that would be OK if it happens because it would mean this monkey is off my back and it doesn't have to be said any more.
Right, I am getting your family confused again. It is your father who is the ambot, isn't it?
Passport, Quixtar and Bashing; What's the relation? Lets see!
there comes a time when you want to perhaps put the past in the past and move on with other things in your life.Ty and other passport folks were prolific posters a year ago in quixtarBLOG forum.
I'm posting an entry from former diamond blog. It was at http://formerdiamond.typepad.com/ and now its gone. I found it on archive.org. I'll publish one on every Friday. I like archive.org but don't trust them. Try searching TOD stuff there. Besides, Quixtar legal goons could pressure archive.org to remove it and BO won't even know it.
The 3 myths I will discuss are:
1. Diamonds are free:
The fact of the matter is they are not. In this instance I am not referring to the approximate 20 kingpins that have created enormous tool businesses. In my opinion, most of them are simply “hooked” on the power at this point. As well, it is important to point out that several of the senior diamonds have saved enough money to walk away with no financial concerns. I am referring to the bulk of the people that have ever worn a diamond pin.
Some people that are critical of my telling the truth as I lived it will simply discount my statements as untrue. They will tell you that they know their diamonds and they know they are free. They will say things like, “Call them at 10am from the office and you will find them just getting out of bed.” What they fail to tell you is that the reason they are just getting out of bed is that they did not get back form showing the plan until about 3am the night before. I would suggest that they have traded a daytime job for the mid-night shift. Most of the diamonds I knew worked harder and longer at this than at their former jobs.
Haven’t you ever wondered why they sell the idea of 2-5 years and then “you can go and do whatever your heart desires”; yet they are still doing the same thing. For many, it is not out of love for the “business.” As I traveled into 20 countries speaking for these people I found that many of them resented the business. Many of their children did as well, because it robbed them of time with their parents.
Important point: They are so busy simply because they are not duplicating anything, they are replacing what they have lost. That is the constant struggle. In the mid 90’s the company said the “business” had about 7 billion dollars in retail sales. If I am not mistaken that figure, which today includes all of the Alticor business, is in the $4.5 billion range. There is no freedom or duplication when you are apparently moving backwards.
Prior to my resigning, I spent many late nights with many diamonds as we spoke openly about the fact that there is no freedom. Unfortunately most of them do not have the courage to do anything about it. Why? Because they are not free and many are afraid of losing the only income they have!
2. Diamonds are diamonds:
Once again this is not true. Most diamonds were diamonds. I am a perfect example of this. Just like most emeralds were emeralds, and most 1000’s were 1000’s. It is no different for a diamond. The overwhelming number of diamonds I knew were not qualifying. They will not tell you that. It would undermine what you think of their leadership.
In my case I qualified once in 1995. I have been very open about this over the past 3 years. I wanted people to know that their diamonds are no different than their own 1000’s. Unfortunately, once you attain a pin you are always recognized for that pin. I believe, if your diamond actually wore the “pins they are” the army would flee as the truth would collide with the myth.
One of my problems with the pin system is the illusion that is perpetuated on the part of the emeralds and above. These are critical “points of control” in the line of sponsorship. Most platinums walk on stage and people say, “They are making $2000 month minimum. Most of the platinums I knew, in numerous “training” systems, were not making $800 per month.
Important point: Do not be misled by the average diamond income of $149k as represented by the company. If I am not mistaken that refers to the average qualified diamond. The question you should ask is, “What is the median income for the individual that wears a diamond pin whether they are qualified or not?” In my opinion, I would estimate that figure to be less than $100k.
Your diamonds would scoff at that. Then again, I remember when these same diamonds said, “there was no money in the tools.” My how things change.
3. Diamonds would never manipulate their volume:
With all due respect, this is nonsense. I am not referring to the kingpins who may no longer care about their qualification. I am referring to the average diamond that you look to for guidance. To assume that many of these people do not/or did not purchase volume to qualify at least once is silly. In other instances, many distributors miraculously went platinum thereby enabling an emerald to move on to diamond.
Why? Because it is how they have been taught to build the business. The language changes but the results are the same. When you are at 750 points many of distributors received a call from their upline encouraging them to buy 250 points. They say, “You will go 1000 and your group will see you and they will move on. Remember, leaders lead!” They call it “stretching.” The fact is that you just bought (manipulated) 25% of your business. What did this do to your upline? In many instances, it moved them along at your expense.
I discussed this in detail several years ago. I used my business as the example. I bought 2/3’s of my 6th leg in Honduras. I was there with a number of emeralds that qualified as diamonds alongside me. What was taking place was unspoken between us, as we all knew that the “language of it” was different than “stretching”. However, it was a practice that is taught to the newest person going after their first 1000 pin.
An interesting thing happens between the platinum and emerald levels; that is where the language changes. It is no longer “stretching”, it is “manipulating” or “buying volume.” The reason for the name change is simple; the upline does not want to share the tool money that now has to travel down to the new pin.
Important point: Whether you are at 750 going 1000 or an emerald going diamond, it is the same behavior, although the outcome is different. The 1000’s usually fall back to 800 points, but the new diamond gets a bigger piece of the tool money.
I do not know how many diamonds I spoke with that did the same thing. It is what they were taught as new distributors. Some bought vacuum cleaners, others bought vitamins, others sponsored family members that grew overnight, and others flew to foreign markets and came back with miracle stories. In groups where bonus checks and product pick-up was run through the upline and not the corporation the ability to transfer points was much easier.
As a disclaimer, I am not saying that this was true in every instance, but to assume it was uncommon is silly.
I believe that people need to understand that the loud voice booming through the microphone is not a wizard. In many instances it is quite the opposite. It is an individual that happened to work hard at the right time (I’ll discuss that in another commentary), get some lucky breaks along the way, and unfortunately, in many instances forgot the people that got them there.
Many diamonds I know are in denial, as they actually believe the publicity that precedes them. However, what many have forgotten is that the applause was taught by them to their teams. Many have a sense of entitlement to their position. While many are greedy, not all are. Many simply lack the courage to stand up to the kingpins.
The fact is however, that many of them are perpetuating something that they themselves did not do. Unfortunately, the army does not know this, so the army feels like they are losers and unable to accomplish something that is sold as “great.” The sad truth is, in my opinion, the average honorable distributor has not been told the truth in the first place.Sincerely,
Think and Grow Rich Blog
CNN.com - Cabbie: Couple's story didn't 'wash' - Aug 11, 2005
Two fugitives suspected of having murdered a Tennessee prison guard in a courtroom escape couldn't convince their cabby they were headed to an Amway convention. What was the tell-tale clue that gave them away? Did the cabby know it's called "Quixtar" now? Nope:If you see it on CNN, The reporters and camera men where hysterical laughing in the background.
"The cover story they gave me didn't really seem to wash too much," Wagers said. "I could kinda see through that. But I had no indication that these guys were really dangerous or they were on the run."
Wagers said he had doubts about the Hyattes' story because they "just didn't fit the type."
He said his suspicions weren't aroused by anything the couple said, except that they didn't try to aggressively recruit him after telling him they were Amway salespeople.
"You know, Amway people are all about Amway, and when they didn't -- when they didn't try any conversation further about it, that's when I pretty much thought, well, they're not with Amway," Wagers said.
During the ride, he said, he and his passengers "chitchatted about nonsensical things" and they told him they were from Virginia. They also explained that they were taking a cab to Columbus for an Amway conference because they had been involved in a car accident the day before.
"They didn't strike me as the Amway type because to be honest they weren't very pushy about their product and I've dealt with them before so -- that was my only real suspicion," Wagers said.
I have recently made some changes to this blog.
QBlog for being a hired stooge of Bo Short. It seems wrong, but not so fast!
Network Marketing Audio Training Clips
MLM is really icky. Why is that? A lot of people who are not professional salesman join MLM and end up doing a lot of things they are not supposed to do. E.g. pressuring friends and family to buy stuff etc. or join them. How many of them do Natural Selling?
Why would a company with 30 years of brand recognition change its name? Same plan, same business model, same lines of IBOs, same products. Then why change the name? Just because it's moving online? A lot of business moved online. They didn't change their name.
To put it simply, Randy Haugen is the reason Quixtar exists today. Without Randy's stupid mistake (being recorded as he spread the P&G Satanism rumor) we'd still be calling the business Amway in North America.
Here's what happened.
There are some details missing, feel free to fill them in. The main point is that Randy Haugen started a chain reaction that resulted in the formation of Quixtar (at least in part), the drafting of the BSMAA and an overall admission that the tool business is where the real money comes from. If Randy had never made those recorded comments P&G would never have had the ammo to sue Amway and much of the documentation and admission would never have surfaced to give Schwartz and Wilkes the data they needed to give their sites credibility.
- Rumors start up in the 1980s about P&G being a bunch of Satanists. Coincidentally, P&G was the "boogeyman" that Amway reps used in their recruitment pitches. "You don't want your money for soap going to P&G when you could be spending it on your business." As an aside, what company has replaced P&G as the "monolithic corporate boogeyman" in Quixtar recruitment pitches today?
- There was no clear evidence that Amway started the Satanism rumor but for years P&G suspected that Amway was behind it and both companies "worked" together to stop the rumor.
- Randy Haugen sent an AmVox message clearly spreading the Satanism rumor in the late 1990s (check the date on that). Now P&G had their proof and the lawsuits began. Remember that discovery and expert opinion are often part of such lawsuits.
- At about the same time, Sydney Schwartz and Ashley Wilkes were running sites and participating in discussion boards that were not only critical of Amway but started taking a close look at the tool businesses. Remember that until the late '90s and early 2000, there was no system-wide admission that tool money constituted any portion of the leadership revenue. It was all described as "covering costs" with a very modest kickback.
- As the P&G lawsuit progressed, information became publicly available that proved what Schwartz and Wilkes had been saying all along -- The real money is in the tools, not Amway.
- Two important documents came out of the P&G lawsuits:
1. Blakey Report and
2. Postma Memo.
- Others dissatisfied with Amway were now beginning to turn to the Internet to tell their story (Jeff Probant for example) and people like Schwartz and Wilkes gained credibility as their information was detailed and factual. Amway realized it had a problem and began an aggressive campaign to shut down the growing numbers of websites through legal manipulation and intimidation. Some of that worked but as you know, once something hits the Internet it can't be removed... ever!
- Amway starts to see a significant decline in revenue and the so-called kingpins demand action. There had been talk about tapping into the "e-commerce" boom and this seemed like the perfect opportunity to make a clean break from the Amway baggage and reinvent the business. Around the same time the BSMAA was drafted and shoved down the IBOs throats to provide protection to the tool distributors as more and more of the rank and file became aware of the real money involved with tools.
So, thank you Randy.
What's amazed me is that after such a boneheaded act, Randy is still very much in the fold. A business that seemingly discards its trouble-makers with ease (anyone remember Team in Focus?) has held onto Randy Haugen through thick and thin. Why? My only guess is that he's personally protected by Dexter or Britt.
GOP For Sale...Blood Money?
Add 5, 10, 20, Even 30 New Associates Into Their Quixtar Business
You Will learn how to do it without the help of those expensive double-opt-in Internet lead programs, without pestering your friends or family members, and without having to sell your soul to the red guy downstairs.Wow!
My comments are in italics. Rest are quotes from DSA fake domain pyramid scheme alerts.com.
Thousands of Americans have lost millions of dollars participating in pyramid schemes. Many of the victims knew they were gambling (although they didn't know the odds were rigged against them). Many others, however, thought they were paying for help in starting a small business of their own. These people were fooled by pyramid schemes disguised to look like legitimate businesses.And there's a negative consumer alert as well
CONSUMER ALERTHow ironic, LOL!
Avoid dealing with salespeople who:
Avoid dealing with companies that:
- Disparage other products or firms. (Satanism?)
- Confuse you, abuse your trust, or exploit your lack of experience or knowledge.
- Try to make you cancel a contract made with another salesperson.(BSMAA?)
- Falsely tell you they're taking a survey or you've just won a contest.(How bout joint venture of Microsoft and IBM?)
What is a pyramid scheme?
- Charge a substantial entry fee (more than the cost of a sales kit).
- Pressure you to purchase large quantities of products.
- Do not repurchase inventory if you decide to leave the business. (Tools and products on eBay?)
- Sell few or no products to consumers.Pyramid schemes are illegal scams in which large numbers of people at the bottom of the pyramid pay money to a few people at the top.
Things you should know about pyramid schemes
- They are losers. Pyramiding is based on simple mathematics: many losers pay a few winners.
- They are fraudulent.
Participants in a pyramid scheme are, consciously or unconsciously, deceiving those they recruit. Few would pay to join if the diminishing odds were explained to them.
Speaking of douche bags....
Registrant:Here is screen cap.
DIRECT SELLING ASSOCIATION
1275 PENNSYLVANIA AVENUE NW STE. 800
WASHINGTON, DC US
Created on 04-14-2003
Expires on 04-14-2006
Amway Quixtar Business Myths - 18 reasons Quixtar is not Amway
Atkins diet company files for bankruptcy
The once mighty Atkins Nutritionals Inc, the multimillion-dollar company that produces the low-carb products that feed the diet craze, filed for bankruptcy protection in a Manhattan court after recording a loss of $US340 million ($A446 million) last year.And there's a reason for it. Health craze over. Eating expensive bars / shakes / vitamins don't do jack unless you get off your fat butt and excercise.