Saturday, January 14, 2006

Annoying IBOs

Telemarketers annoy you, no?

In the same way, IBOs are annoying. Even more so then telemarketers. They put you down because they have this percieved notion that you are a loser of you don't do Quixtar.

Then people:
  1. Blog about it
  2. Talk negatively
  3. Make fun of IBOs
And negativity increases. Don't complain any one for ruining your business. You are the one pissing ppl off. And these are the poeple who don't sign up as IBO.

I don't know what Quixtar Corp is doing to change it? Are they doing any thing to change it?

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72 Comments:

At 1/17/2006 11:59:00 AM, Anonymous Emily said...

I don't think anyone's a loser for not doing Quixtar! and I'm an IBO... nice generalization! Are all black people lazy? All mexicans have bad tempers?, and all Germans are Nazi's?? Get a clue "Loser".

How ironic you complain about IBO's calling non-IBO's "losers", and That's the screen name you give yourself. Sounds like its YOU with the perceived notion, not IBOs. I don't put anyone down for not doing it. But people like You deserve to be put down for your blatant ignorance and prejudices!

You did say one accurate thing though, funny you don't take your own advice... "Don't complain any one for ruining your business."
I think you meant "blame", but we got the point. But what are you internet critics doing? Blaming someone else! Oh, it was my upline's fault, oh it was Q*'s fault. How about taking responsibility for Yourself?

I've said it before and I'll say it again... at one time all of you "disgruntled IBOs" tried to build the business. You went to the meeting and said, "yea, I could do that". But none of your friends did it. You couldn't handle the "no's". Maybe YOU were one of those overbearing IBOs and pissed off your friends, so you decided to quit! But you know darn well that if Any of your downline had built it, and had the success I see on My team, you'd still be building it! If the 1st 3 people you sponsered went 6000pv in 3 months, you wouldn't be on here bashing it! But that didn't happen, did it? None of you had 3 platinums in the works, did you?

Not enough of your friends said yes. So now you come on here and Pass the Blame! THAT makes you a loser!! A Pathetic Loser!

The only thing worse than That is being excited about the business, and then deciding not to pursue it because of something you read on Here! How dumb do you have to be to make a business decision based on negative hype on an internet blogsite! You deserve what you get. Hey you might want to check out some Yahoo chatrooms too, I hear there's a 13 year old kid giving some hot stock tips!! :P

 
At 1/17/2006 12:21:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

Well, Amway changed their name to quixtar. Could it be due to the negative reaction people had when they heard Amway?

Funny, Emily says she doesn't think of anyone as a loser for not doing quixtar then later in her post, she says

"Not enough of your friends said yes. So now you come on here and Pass the Blame! THAT makes you a loser!! A Pathetic Loser!"

And people wonder how they (amway/quixtar) IBO's get a bad reputation.

 
At 1/17/2006 03:12:00 PM, Anonymous Emily said...

"I don't think anyone's a loser for not doing Quixtar!"

True statement! Have fun proving otherwise!

"I don't put anyone down for not doing it. But people like You deserve to be put down for your blatant ignorance and prejudices!"

Still following me Joe? Not doing it doesn't make you a loser nor does it mean you should be put down... but being ignorant like Imran/loser and making general prejudice statements, as he Did, does open you up to scrutiny!

"Not enough of your friends said yes. So now you come on here and Pass the Blame! THAT makes you a loser!! A Pathetic Loser!"

Notice the emphasis on "THAT"... as in "THAT makes you a loser!"
Not doing Q* does NOT make you a loser! Quiting it doesn't even make you a loser. But when you Quit and then come on here and bash Q* and pass the blame, and call it a scam - THAT makes you a loser!! Does that make sense to you? Should I use smaller words?

Nice try jerk for trying to make me look like a liar or that I contradicted myself! I did NO such thing! That is the Perfect example of why more IBOs don't post on these sites, cause jerkbots like you come on here twist the very things we say!

Did you buy those stocks yet? Come on, jump on it, that kid said XYZ company was sure to go thru the roof!

 
At 1/17/2006 03:22:00 PM, Anonymous Emily said...

Oh and by the way - amway didn't "change their name" - amway is still a billion dollar company! Q* is simply a sister company of amway - they're owned by the same company Alticor.
There was nothing wrong with amway, they had alot of great products but there was a negative conotation due to Some people (probably some of You critics) being overbearing, and pushy!

The mentality today with Q* is Much different. Most teams teach Not to be pushy, or overbearing, just checking interest, sharing the concept, etc. If someone's interested- great, if they're not, no big deal!

And with Ditto, and all the new exclusives, and the Partner stores,etc- people who think they know what this is because they knew something about amway, have no idea what this is!

 
At 1/17/2006 06:50:00 PM, Blogger Loser said...

All the "pushy" IBOs I've ever seen were in Quixtar. I've never met a "current" amway IBO.

Amway north America changes it's name to Quixtar and whole LOS got transfered intact. It is a lie to say Quixtar has nothing to do with amway. Amway keeps it's name in rest of the world, since they don't have the negative stigma attached like here in America.

 
At 1/18/2006 11:42:00 AM, Anonymous Emily said...

"It is a lie to say Quixtar has nothing to do with amway."

Gee, I guess its a good thing I DIDN'T Say That then! Once again, nice subtle implication that I'm a liar, or hiding something! I never said it had nothing to do with. I said they're Sister companies both owned by the Same company, Alticor!

"Amway keeps it's name in rest of the world, since they don't have the negative stigma attached like here in America."

I wonder if thats partly because some Americans are a bunch of whiny spinless crybabies? "Oh, it didn't work for me it must be a scam". Thats why so many foreigners come to the US, and MAKE something of themselves, because of their work ethic. But then their kids and grandkids grow-up in the liberal "its not your fault", "blame somebody else" mindset. So here it has a negative stigma, but over in India, and Asia no such stigma exists, even though its been there for years and years... hmm, interesting.

"All the "pushy" IBOs I've ever seen were in Quixtar. I've never met a "current" amway IBO."

Well duh! You'd have to be overseas to meet an amway distributor. Their may be some "pushy" IBOs in Q*, but its not like it used to be.

Thats why the stigma is going away. The mentality is: don't be pushy, if they say "no" its no big deal, you can't make somebody do this, they would've just wasted your time. You're just offering an oppotunity and looking for the people that say yes.

Most young people today, amway doesn't even mean anything to them- and most IBOs know not to be pushy, just have the right attitude.

The only real negative out there is all this crap on the Net. People calling it a scam cause it didn't work for them, or calling it a cult becuase its outside the "norm", or cause people go to conferences where people cheer, kinda like a concert or football game... but that's different I guess.

Whatever, have a fun time spinning something else I've said.

 
At 1/18/2006 12:21:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

Quixtar or Amway, whatever the name, don't they sell nutrilite and SA8? It's the same thing with a different name. IBO's still sneak around books stores trying to prospect people and the same old kingpins are still selling useless information to unsuspecting downline.

Emily says blaming your friends who said no makes you a loser. I disagree. Being deceptive to prospects makes the business a scam. True, there are some ethical LOS, but the bigger ones have plenty of documented abuse. People who say no have already seen through the smoke and mirrors.

 
At 1/18/2006 05:50:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

Emily Said "Not enough of your friends said yes. So now you come on here and Pass the Blame! THAT makes you a loser!! A Pathetic Loser!"

For many of us, it wasn't a lack of support from friends that caused us to leave the business. It was discovery of upline lies, upline deception, upline trying to control out lives (asking permission to have kids), the dark secret about the tools business.

You can read many stories of upline abuse which lead to downline businesses folding. You may have a good upline, but most of us who post here did not. It certainly doesn't invalidate our perception of the business because we experienced the bad side.

 
At 1/19/2006 12:28:00 PM, Anonymous Emily said...

Joe, nice job of misquoting me, and then figuring it out, at least I think you figured it out.

Here's my problem. You say it wasn't a lack of support from friends (which is BS cause if you had 25 friends go 1000pv, you still be hung ho!) but you say it was the "discovery of upline lies, disception, them trying to control you". So WHY are you bashing Q*? Why doesn't a Single one of you Weenies, say "my name is Joe, my sponsor was Dick Deception and he was a bad man!" No one does that! You all call the WHOLE Thing a scam! Why?! THAT'S my problem with you people!

You Admit that there are good and ethical lines of sponsorship, but claim that Your upline were bad... so Why is the whole thing a scam then?

You mention "asking permission to have kids". Do you have a spine? Give me a break. I don't care if you've got an upline telling you to postpone kids until your 7500, its Advice, its a TIP. If you want to have kids, then just do it! This isn't Nazi Germany. Didn't you Realize this was Your business, do what you want. Take advice or don't take advice. Stop lieing to us about them "controlling your life"!

And the "dark secret of tools" - blahblahblahblahblah. Get Over it! EVERYONE knows about tools and the available profit from tools! I don't care if it was "quiet" in the past. They Openly talk about it now. Its mentioned at every open meeting I've been to! And for crying out loud, the whole thing is OPTIONAL! You don't have to go to seminars, you don't Have to buy books or CD's. You can say they pressure you all you want, you don't HAVE to do anything! If you see no value in it, don't use it! If your upline won't work with you because of it, tell Q*... or better yet, go out there and build your Own business. Pass your sponsor up!

Sorry if these principles and views are abstract to you. I was raised in a Conservative home, where I was taught to take responsibilty, work hard for what you want, be helpful and caring to others, and stand-up for yourself.

If you had a problem with your upline, then talk about Your Upline! Don't tell me that I'm in some scam or that I'M deceiving or lieing to people! Does that sound fair enough?

(But I don't think I'll hold my breathe on That one)

 
At 1/19/2006 02:04:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

A quick comment/rebuttal to EMILY's suggestion that Amway didn't change their name to Quixtar. Here's a link to the Virginia State Corporation Records information.

http://amquix.info/pdfs/quixtar_amway_VA.pdf

Boy, this myth has been debunked SO MANY TIMES, yet Quixtar IBOs keep repeating this nonsense... Amazing!

 
At 1/19/2006 02:34:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

Emily said I misquoted her. Emily, tell me or show me where I said quixtar is a scam. I believe the tools business is a scam. The fact that they didn't talk about before, but now that the internet has exposed the tools business, NOW the diamonds talk about it.

And yes, upline was that controlling when I was in the business. I abandoned my growing 4000 PV business. Why? Because my upline told me to dump my fiance' so my business could grow faster. I did have a spine, that's why I left the business.

No business is worth having big brother (upline) telling me how to live my life. I saw through that and left the business.

I'll say this again, not all uplines are unethical, but lines affiliated with Britt, Yager, and Puryear seem to have the most abusive uplines. (Based on my observations)

Emily may have a good upline, but there are meny bad ones. How is a prospect to know who's good or bad? Since it's a crapshoot, and since Tools are optional but so is success, then in general, if you participate in the tools, you are being scammed.

 
At 1/19/2006 02:55:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

Emily and Tony would make a good Q couple.

 
At 1/19/2006 04:19:00 PM, Anonymous Emily said...

Oooh, so AmwayUSA, Inc. changed their name to Quixtar. All I said was Amway is still Amway. They're still around, they still did like 6 billion dollars last year. And I've never said or implied there was no affiliation between the 2. You can A=B=C all you want, the fact is Quixtar is owned by Alticor who also owns Amway, Access Business Group. So Quixtar is a Sister company to Amway Corp. Yes, some of the people who were distributors 10 years ago were able to switch their business to the Q* model. With the addition of the Partner Stores, utilizing the web model, checks & products coming directly fronm the Corp and not from Upline, the business was totally revolutionized, and rightfully reformed. General Electric used to be called Edison Electric. Companies change names, they reinvent themselves, etc. But hey good work Columbo, thanks for the history update :)

Joe you quit at 4000pv because you upline told you to leave your fiance, and you call That having a backbone? Yea, you really showed him! You Gave him 4000pv and probably half a dozen more personal legs!

Here's a clue, "having a backbone" would have been you saying "no actually I love her, I can build it with or without her" and then just Ignored his advice, and Built it BIG! Did you even Consider that option? Did it even Occur to you that you could've just chosen Not to take his advice? You could've stayed with her, and just kept doing what you were doing. There had to be more than that. Cause common sense tells you to ignore the advice and just stay steady.
I listen to my upline, but if one of them told me to kill my dog or run down the street naked, there comes a point where you say, "OK, I think I'll pass on that" and then build your business Past them, so you don't ever have to deal with them. People build this all the time with no upline help. People that are 22 hours from their mentors, still build big businesses.

You said "if you participate in the tools, you are being scammed."

So even if you find value in the system, you're being scammed? Even if you think the functions, CDs, books, etc are Helping you, you think we're being scammed? I totally disagree, but I'm so glad you think you know whats best for everybody else.

And if you want to play semantics regarding "tell me or show me where I said quixtar is a scam". Gime me a break. 1st of all I refering to all critics in general: "You all call the WHOLE Thing a scam! Why?! THAT'S my problem with you people!

But let's look at some of your comments Joe, regarding the business just on This Thread.

"Amway changed their name to quixtar. Could it be due to the negative reaction people had when they heard Amway?"

Gee, is that positive or negative toward Q* - that could be read as an unfavorable comment toward Q* - aka "bashing".

"And people wonder how they (amway/quixtar) IBO's get a bad reputation."

Mmm, sounds negative toward the business again.

"IBO's still sneak around books stores trying to prospect people and the same old kingpins are still selling useless information to unsuspecting downline."

Wow, there we have stereotypes, generalizations... I like the use of "kingpin"... and "useless information" gee thanks for your omnipotent viewpoint. Joe knows whats best for all ;)

Oh, here's a whammy!...
"Being deceptive to prospects makes the business a scam."

Joe lets just cut to the chase, you;re blogging on a site called "QuixtarSucks!" You're a Critic. Don't act like you don't bash this business!! You can say its just the tools you have a problem with, but you sure as heck chime in with little stabs and digs on anything regarding this business. And the Fact still remains, I've never seen ONE critic name his deceptive upline. If you're trying to warn people, why not say "BillyBob tried to get me to leave my girl and then he kicked my dog." But that never happens, you people just whine and complain about ALL IBOs, and the business in general, its the same on all these sites!

Whatever, i'm tired wasting time with you guys. If Tony's a real man, and stands up for himself, doesn't "pass the buck" and run home crying to mommy the 1st time he got a "NO"... then I'd rather have him over any of you would-be men anyday!

 
At 1/20/2006 03:45:00 AM, Blogger Loser said...

Yes, some of the people who were distributors 10 years ago were able to switch their business to the Q* model.

Dear Miss Emily, this is misleading.

Repeat after me: ALL Awmay LOS, not some IBOs, were transfered to Quixtar. Some are still on standard fulfillment! Old amway system, not much moving to the Q* model.

Here is what happened, Grand daughter of Walter Bass, who helped incorporating Amway in 50s, saved amway's butt in 70s and had Yager DEEP in his group said:

http://tinyurl.com/ceepa

Regarding names: at that time, you had several options, since Amway still was a N America company, too. Our company chose to be "Amway Distributors, with an option to use Quixtar" - yep, that's how we renewed.... there were 4 choices: Amway only; Quixtar only: Amway with option to use Q; and Q with option to use Amway. Yeesh.....

Later, Alticor was formed; and people who had been "Amway Distributors" were automatically converted over into "Quixtar IBOs.


Also, this might help!

http://www.amquix.info/quixtar_is_amway.html

 
At 1/20/2006 12:08:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

Emily

Provide some specific examples of how those seminars help to build a business. In my time, it was a lot of hype, but not a lot of substance. Same goes for the tapes/cd's.

Show some specific examples of how you save money by using quixtar. I can show you plenty examples where you don't.

For the old systems, like WWDB, they still have product call in and pick up. Therefore, you are paying premium prices, plus SHIPPING fees, yet you still have to drive to your upline's house to
get your stuff. Isn't that efficient?

Sure, people may see value in the teaching system, but what is that value since the vast majority of IBO's don't make a profit after business expenses. Prove me wrong if you can.

When I left, I took my group with me. Our upline was very controlling and they actually taught stuff like asking permission to have kids. Having them tell me to leave my fiance was the last straw.

By the way Emil, are you making any money after subtracting business expenses?

 
At 1/20/2006 01:41:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

Emily,

My upline was Scott Harimoto. He was at the time a founder's diamond, I think he just got his new pin recently, an emerald pin.

We were taught that WWDB was non-profit. That later changed to WWDB is a for profit company, but they don't keep any profits, they channel all monies back into the business. Found out later what a big lie that was.

Even though generalizations may be used to describe quixtar, it's because the biggest LOS (Yager, britt, Puryear) seem to have the most stories of abuse. I don't think that all LOS are abusive, but enough of them exist where a warning to all prospective IBO's are warranted.

There are some who post here who are retail IBO's and don't encourage tools. The critics have civil and educational discussions with these IBO's.

Emily, you may have a differnt experience that some of us here, but that certainly doesn't invalidate what I experienced in the business. It's easy to say you could have done this, or should have disreagrded upline's advice. It wasn't that simple back in 1997-1998 when I was active. You had to experience it for yourself.

 
At 1/20/2006 03:01:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

EMILY SAID>>How ironic you complain about IBO's calling non-IBO's "losers", and That's the screen name you give yourself.

Emily, you hit the nail on the head with the word, IRONIC. That's exactly what Imran is trying to convey with that username. IRONY! Because he quit the business, and because he has heard many Quixtar IBOs call quitters 'losers'. I have heard the same myself, MANY, MANY TIMES. And go and read all the Critical websites. You will find LOTS of similar comments from Pro-Quixtar people.

EMILY SAID>>There was nothing wrong with amway, they had alot of great products but there was a negative conotation due to Some people (probably some of You critics) being overbearing, and pushy!

Emily, emily... *sigh*... Amway's reputation was not because of some people. Rich Devos, one of the co-founders said it himself. (click on the link and scroll down halfway to read what he had to say). And if you want to read the whole transcript of what Rich Devos had to say, it's right here.
All the abuses, deceptions, income misrepresentations, system-money, conflicts of interest, cult-like-tactics etc.

EMILY SAID>>Oooh, so AmwayUSA, Inc. changed their name to Quixtar. All I said was Amway is still Amway.

NO, Emily, this is what you said, at first.

EMILY SAID>>Oh and by the way - amway didn't "change their name" - amway is still a billion dollar company! Q* is simply a sister company of amway - they're owned by the same company Alticor.

Again, AMWAY USA DID CHANGE ITS NAME.

EMILY SAID>>Yes, some of the people who were distributors 10 years ago were able to switch their business to the Q* model.

WRONG. EVERY single Amway USA Distributor HAD TO SWITCH OVER to Quixtar. THEY HAD NO CHOICE IN THE MATTER. Amway USA is NOW defunct. That corporation doesn't exist anymore. It is NOW called Quixtar.

EMILY SAID>>General Electric used to be called Edison Electric. Companies change names, they reinvent themselves, etc.

Yes, and LUCENT changed to AWAYA. But that had NOTHING to do with peope's perceptions of the company. In Amway's case IT HAD EVERYTHING TO DO WITH IT. Why else did they keep implying initially when Quixtar was launched, that it had nothing to do with Amway??

EMILY SAID>>But hey good work Columbo, thanks for the history update :)

Oooh, Emily, what a putdown... I am crying :( right now.

Got to run, but I will be back to address some more of the issues you raised.

 
At 1/20/2006 06:25:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

Emily, here's something more to chew on. Rich Devos' ONE statement summarizing his "Directly Speaking Tape" that I referred you to earlier.

"I'm telling you I need you're help on cleaning up some of these situations. Now, I got -- as we said -- I got stacks of letters that came in -- I -- I can't tell you how many of people have written. Hundreds and thousands."

So..... NO. It was not because of some people's actions that Amway got its lousy reputation.

 
At 1/22/2006 09:01:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

So my girlfriend's mother-in-law fell hook, line and sinker for quixtar. Her children tried talking to her to no avail. Anyone have any thoughts on how to help her? She is very quickly going deeper and deeper in debt.

Thank-you in advance.

 
At 1/22/2006 10:13:00 PM, Blogger Loser said...

To talk to her out of it, do following things:

Research on Cult Mind Control. They'll be telling you specific techniques. What I would do is:

1) Research on Steve Hassan. And he's accessible and knows about it.

2) Talk to her. Don't disagree / disrespectful. Try talking to her without her upline.

3) Have her write her REAL profit / loss. Fuel is expensive and time is money.

4) Have some points ready. e.g. 3-4% families in US already millionaire, less than 1% in Q.

 
At 1/23/2006 03:09:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

This is for "anonymous" who was asking for help to deprogram his girl-friend's mother.

First, let me say, I feel for you and your girlfriend. I will definitely keep her in my prayers. I would suggest that as a starting point for you also.

Whenever you try to give her advice, chances are you will invariably get the response, "Why are you being negative?" One way to answer this is to calmly ask her, "Consider this. If you were about to jump off a cliff, and I told you not to do it, that it would be harmful for you, would you ask me why I was being negative? The question is not whether the information is negative, the question is whether the information is truthful." I think that's a good opening gambit. And I think you definitely want to start with 'consider this'. It is very conciliatory. Or perhaps, even better, start by telling her how much you care for your girlfriend, and how much you respect her as your girlfriend's mother.

Also, Imran gave very good advice. Don't be confrontational or judgmental or disrespectful. Your tone is key. Then tell her that all you want to do is, for her to consider the information you give her, with an open mind. "Just one chance".

Then I would suggest that you make her read two posts by Imran on this very blog. It's in the archives, but I will give you the direct url:

http://quixtarsucks.blogspot.com/2004/08/cost-of-being-ibo.html

http://quixtarsucks.blogspot.com/2004/08/time-required-to-build-quixtar.html

Excellent, to the point, posts about the COST and TIME, it takes to build this so-called business.

Next, download the MERCHANTS OF DECEPTION book. It's a riveting un-put-downable book. It's nearly 300 pages, so it will take her about 2-3 hours to read it. I think it's a good idea for the three of you to sit together and read it, i.e. make sure that she reads it.

I suggest you and your girlfriend schedule some 'together' time (just the three of you) for at least half a day, and cook lunch/dinner at home or something and ease into this. Make sure you have the time completely to yourselves, without any interruptions. The last thing you want, is for her to go into her defensive mode when the truth is in her face, and have hear leave to counsel with her upline.

I am no cult-deprogrammer/expert. What do the rest of you guys think? Good advice?

 
At 1/23/2006 04:05:00 PM, Blogger Amber said...

Quixtar is awesome. get a life. get free.

 
At 1/23/2006 04:21:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

Ooh Amber.... your dazzling wit, your eloquence, your erudition, just oozes out of that short 10-syllable post.

Please honor us with more of your eloquence. Please do tell us how you are free right now? And of course how much you are making right now, after system expenses?

 
At 1/23/2006 04:50:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

Oh, btw, it might be a good idea to print the MERCHANTS OF DECEPTION book, and have it bound at Fedex/Kinko's and give it to her. Chances are, she might go back to it intermittently to read it, if she has the hard copy with her.

 
At 1/23/2006 10:42:00 PM, Anonymous Jody said...

I posted the question about how to help my girlfriend's mom. Thanks to all of you who responded. I will DL that book and I also really like the "consider this" part. Interesting to hear about the "I am being negative" response as this is exactly what I got.

 
At 1/24/2006 03:35:00 PM, Anonymous Will said...

Hey perceptive, that was a great post! Let's recap...
"I suggest you and your girlfriend schedule some 'together' time (just the three of you) for at least half a day, and cook lunch/dinner at home or something and ease into this. Make sure you have the time completely to yourselves, without any interruptions. The last thing you want, is for her to go into her defensive mode when the truth is in her face, and have hear leave to counsel with her upline."

Didn't you leave out the part where they should tie her to a chair so she can't flee to her upline? Hmm, it almost sounds like you wanna "brainwash" her. It sounds kinda "deceptive".
"schedule some 'together' time (just the three of you) for at least half a day, and cook lunch/dinner at home or something and ease into this" ....interesting.

And then how bout YOU take the Same advice- you want her to "consider the information you give her, with an open mind. "Just one chance".
Well are you willing to do the Sanething? Are you willing to go to an Open meeting, are you willing to spend half a day at a seminar/rally or with some of her mentors to meet them, to get to see what kind of people they are?
Well if you're not, then why the heck should she listen to you?!

Oh and rip on Amber all you want, thing is, you guys will rip on me just as much as you rip on her, only I wasted more time arguing with you critics. She spent less time, so maybe she has the right idea, cause no matter What we say-- you narrow-minded, skeptical, bitter critics are gonna go on thinking the sameway.

1 question Jody: what if this mother-in-law of your friend goes Q-12, Ruby and Emerald. I know a 58 yr old widow who is a Q-12 with 3 legs that are close to Platinum. She will probably be making $90,000+/yr in the next 18 months. So what if woman you know does the samething. What if she goes Diamond? What if she helps 6 people build their business to the 7500pv level where they each make $2600 a month, and they qualify for the $10,000 yearly bonus. Did you even Know about the Q-12 bonus or Q-12 trip. Do you know how the Emerald growth bonus works, or the depth bonus? How much have you tried to find out?

You know if you just listened to negative hype on TV, you might think that the Catholic church is a bunch child-molesting priests. but is that the case? No. Can a Catholic church have a good effect on you, or be full of a lot of good people... yea!

So where are you getting your info on Q*? From Dateline? The show that rigged GM trucks with Sparking devices to make them explode for a "report" they did on them? Or from anonymous critics on the Net that said "its a scam, it didn't work"? Is That your reliable sources? If you're so into getting all the facts, how bout you read http://www.thisbiznow.com. Why not go to www.quixtarfacts.com Why not go to a meeting and then see what you think.

Let's see how open-minded... or hypocritical You are?

 
At 1/24/2006 03:57:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

WILL SAID>>And then how bout YOU take the Same advice- you want her to "consider the information you give her, with an open mind. "Just one chance".
Well are you willing to do the Sanething? Are you willing to go to an Open meeting, are you willing to spend half a day at a seminar/rally or with some of her mentors to meet them, to get to see what kind of people they are?
Well if you're not, then why the heck should she listen to you?!


Okay, pal, here's your answer.

QUIXTAR-AMWAY-INFILTRATOR

Go read that blog. I have attended DOZENS of meetings, rallies, and listened to the nonsense that you peddle there. I have done my own research, thoroughly. I haven't just listened to some critics and decided to bash this so-called 'business'.

As far as my approach being deceptive, I will definitely address that later, got to run now.

Oh, btw, the next time you invite somebody to an 'Open Meeting', be very careful, pal. It might be me. By the time I am through with questioning the speaker, you will not only have lost your prospects, some of your hard-core IBOs in the audience might lost their "faith" ;-)....

 
At 1/24/2006 05:40:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

Will Said: 1 question Jody: what if this mother-in-law of your friend goes Q-12, Ruby and Emerald. I know a 58 yr old widow who is a Q-12 with 3 legs that are close to Platinum. She will probably be making $90,000+/yr in the next 18 months. So what if woman you know does the samething. What if she goes Diamond? What if she helps 6 people build their business to the 7500pv level where they each make $2600 a month, and they qualify for the $10,000 yearly bonus.

Joe said: If she does, she will have about 100-200 downline losing money so she can make money. The downline would be better off just giving her a check for $50 a month without doing the business.

The problem is that everyone in quixtar wants to show the sugar coated "what is possible" scenario while ignoring the "what is likely" scenario.

By the way, just to let you know, many of us "critics" were in the business. Some of us achieved high levels of success and many of us "critics" have researched the business extensively whereas many of you quixtar defenders are relatively new in the business and don't know what you're involved with yet. Now your experience may be good, but mine wasn't. It doesn't make either experience invalid.

However, that being said, simple math proves that quixtar cannot
work unless the majority are losing money so a few can prosper.

 
At 1/25/2006 09:51:00 AM, Blogger perceptive said...

WILL SAID>>Didn't you leave out the part where they should tie her to a chair so she can't flee to her upline? Hmm, it almost sounds like you wanna "brainwash" her. It sounds kinda "deceptive".
"schedule some 'together' time (just the three of you) for at least half a day, and cook lunch/dinner at home or something and ease into this" ....interesting.


Okay, that was very funny. No, seriously, you are a funny guy.

Here's the thing, Will. Quixtar IBOs are trained to immediately reject any advice/information that portrays 'the business' in a bad light, irrespective of the validity of the criticism. They are told to counsel/listen only to their upline. Their upline has a financial interest in keeping them in the business. They will NEVER give her advice that would make her question the 'business'.

My own personal experience with many IBOs are that they are completely brainwashed by their upline. They blindly listen to the nonsense that their upline peddles. Classic sign of a cult. It is almost impossible to reason with them. There were times when I just wanted to grab them by their collar and shake them and scream at them, "My God, what is it that you don't see"?

Let's consider a hypothetical scenario, say one of your siblings is in a cult. You advise him that he is in a cult, and being abused. But he has been indoctrinated for such a long time, that he can't fathom his cult leader being anything other than perfect. And he has been trained to reject outside criticism immediately. So he rejects your advice, even before you have a chance to present all the FACTS, and he goes and talks to his cult leader. By the time the cult leader is through with advising him, he is even more strongly in the grip of the cult. Your window of opportunity is small. If you don't get a chance to convey all the facts in that one opportunity, you might never get a chance again, until too much damage has been done.

Jody and his girl-friend might get this one chance, only. People have been known to spend years in cults, inspite of overwhelming evidence in their face that it is hurting them. Look at Eric Scheibeler, he was working 100-hour weeks for many years for a paltry $30,000 yearly income, and running up debt. And the fear here is that she will spend too much in this so-called 'business' and rack up debt that will eventually hurt her badly. I can pretty much bet that the moment his girl-friend's mother is presented with the TRUTH, her first reaction will be to reject it and run to counsel with her upline. And of course, we all know what unbiased ;-) advice her upline is going to give her.

It's almost like you Quixtar IBOs don't understand the principle of "Conflict Of Interest". I don't care how virtuous a man is, if he is placed in a position of having a conflict of interest, chances are very high that he will be biased towards his own interest. THAT IS JUST HUMAN NATURE.

Consider this. Say I like a girl in my church. And let's say our Pastor's son also has an interest in her. The Pastor likes her too. Let's say I have a great relationship with the Pastor, and he's my personal counselor/advisor too. The Pastor is a man of impeccable integrity, has great wisdom, and has always given me perfect advice. I take advice from him on practically every important decision of my life. BUT, do you think I would ask him advice on whether this particular girl is the right one for me, whether I should date/marry her or not? NOT IN A MILLION YEARS!!! I don't care how virtuous he is, when faced with a conflict of interest it IS human nature to be partial to your own interests.

Okay, hopefully you now understand the principle of 'Conflict Of Interest'. Now, consider this. Jody and his girl-friend have ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to gain, either way, by talking her into getting out of the business. They just want to make sure she doesn't hurt herself by getting further into debt. On the contrary, her upline has a vested financial interest in keeping her in the business. Guess who has the 'Conflict Of Interest'?

So.... NO. The idea is not to "tie her to a chair", and "brainwash" her, as you so nicely put it. The idea is to get enough time to present ALL the FACTS (not just the one-sided nonsense that her upline will tell her) to her and help her make the RIGHT decision.

Which is "LEAVE QUIXTAR. RUN FOR YOUR LIFE".

Joecool put it perfectly. Even if she is successful in recruiting a whole bunch of people and making some money, it will be at the expense of a whole bunch of other people losing money. I am not going to waste my time regurgitating my argument about this, but I have made a detailed argument on my blog about this. Read all the posts with an open mind, starting with the first post.

WILL SAID>> You know if you just listened to negative hype on TV, you might think that the Catholic church is a bunch child-molesting priests. but is that the case? No. Can a Catholic church have a good effect on you, or be full of a lot of good people... yea!

Yes, you are right Will, just because there were some priests who were child-molesters, does NOT mean every Catholic Priest is a child molester. BUT, when the Catholic Church's Top Leaders are aware of the problem and try to gloss over the problem and transfer the offending priests to different parishes, and try to "sweep the problem under the rug", IT IS UNPARDONABLE. The Catholic Church's Leadership was COMPLICIT in this crime. And the Catholic Church is paying a huge price for this failing of their leadership. A few parishes have gone bankrupt, paying huge settlements to the victims, and the Catholic Church's image has been tarnished for a long time to come.

See any similarities to Quixtar/Amway Corpn.?? They have known about these ABUSES, since at least 1983, as evidenced by Rich Devos' "Directly Speaking Tapes", and the "Ed Postma Memo". And what have they done about it?

NOTHING!! It is hardworking distributors like you who have been financially raped for over 25 years, and they have actually REWARDED the rapists themselves.

Ahh... but maybe I am just wasting my time on you... But I am an optimist...

So, to put your challenge back to you. I have already been doing what you challenged me to do. Are you willing to accept the same challenge?

Go and download the MERCHANTS OF DECEPTION book and read it with an open mind.

 
At 1/25/2006 02:03:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

What happened to Emily?

 
At 1/25/2006 03:01:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Thank you, JOECOOL18 for your honesty. Just to let you know, my husband and I were very strong builders in the business under the Haugen line for 16 years, 10 of which were Ruby directs making $100,000 a year (and spending as much), and we are still card carrying members as we love the DX. Anyhow, our group slowly fizzled away as with the brainwashing our upline was doing to us all, slowly everyone gave up. Everything we did was sabatoged, everyday I wonder why I was so stupid to put up with it, but when you are in the midst of the fight, it is impossible to "get out", I guess that is part of the brainwashing. I used to keep a file drawer filled with daily abuses they pulled on us and our group, I wrote it all down as at the time it was the only way I had to deal with it. I burnt that file recently, thank God, but now I don't take any guff off of anyone, I know how people can screw you if you let them. So thank you for your honesty, our experience was a nightmare. Oh, and we were forced to declare bancruptcy. So much for going Diamond!!! We worked our asses off, too. Have a wonderful day, and keep up the good fight, keep standing up for what is right, because you are right-on!!!

 
At 1/25/2006 03:28:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

Anonymous,

I'm glad you got out. I didn't achieve ruby, but I was considered a mover and shaker when I was active. What I realized was the higher I moved up in pin level, it seemed as if you had a shorter leash put on you by upline. It became where they wanted you to ask permission to use the restroom. I finally saw the light and left when upline told me to dump my fiance so I could build the business faster, perhaps it was a test to see how "teachable" I was. Anyway, I'm glad I'm out and if you were only breaking even at Ruby, that's a scary thought. Thanks for sharing.

 
At 1/25/2006 07:39:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

Anonymous,

It's too bad you burnt that file. It could have been a good addition to the growing pile of evidence that Eric Scheibeler is collecting for the regulators.

 
At 1/27/2006 05:07:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

Joecool,

To answer your question, Emily is on another Critical Blog, defending her 'QuixScam' Business.

 
At 1/27/2006 05:59:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

Doesn't Emily remind you of Tony?

 
At 1/27/2006 09:02:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

Hey Joe,

Were you the one who said earlier in this thread, Tony & Emily would make a good couple ;-)?

 
At 1/28/2006 04:00:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Thank you, JoeCool18 and perceptive for your feedback and positive support. It is because of folks like you that I found out I am not a crazy person like my upline tried to convince me of. Anyhow, as for burning my file of evil things our upline did against us, I had to get that blackness out of our house, if you know what I mean. I also did'nt think we would ever have a case because they were all such snakes, and we had even Fed-Exed our upline diamond begging for help/time, but we were totally ignored. It is a wonder I did'nt have a nervouse breakdown. Anyhow, the burning party came before I was aware all of you cool folks existed, but I could sure recall many atrocities to Mr. Scheibeler if he needs me to. I also site Bruce Anderson's experience as a prime example that you are really on your own when they want to take you down (www.baron55.com), and he had the same upline as we do, oh goodie. I have been in contact with him on email, he wants me to get into the mlm he is in with Brig Hart, a nutritional juice mlm, but I am so leary of mlm's now, it is not funny. So doubt I will take the plunge, even though he says Brig is making fabulouse $, too many bad experiences, I guess. So, just wanted to thank you guys for your concern and for being there for those seeking the truth.....

 
At 1/28/2006 08:47:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

ANON SAID>> Anyhow, as for burning my file of evil things our upline did against us, I had to get that blackness out of our house, if you know what I mean.

I understand.

ANON SAID>>I also did'nt think we would ever have a case because they were all such snakes, and we had even Fed-Exed our upline diamond begging for help/time, but we were totally ignored.

Of course, they had a vested interest in keeping the tools-scam going, so they werren't going to respond. But Eric Scheibeler is still collecting evidence for the regulators. So, I would suggest you write a detailed letter about your experiences to him at enschei@yahoo.com. For far too long, this ruthless corporation has gotten away with this fraud, because most victims thought their experiences were unique. WE NEED TO STAND UP AND FIGHT BACK. Only if we band together and hit back, will this monster be finished. WE HAVE TO PUT THIS COMPANY OUT OF BUSINESS! They have hurt way too many people. I myself am writing a complaint to Quixtar about my experiences at two 'Open Meetings' recently, and am going to put a copy on my blog also, to put them on the spot. We'll see what they do. I am also planning to start a letter-writing campaign to our elected officials as well as FTC regulators, to put them also on the spot. You will be able to read the details on my blog, hopefully, soon. It's just that I am extremely busy at work, and so far haven't found enough time to do this. Hopefully, by the end of this week.

BUT, I hope you will also participate. Can I ask you also to participate in the letter-writing campaign?

 
At 1/29/2006 02:01:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I didnt believe i had to go all the way down to get your name.
I HOPE and PRAY you post this in your site. If its still active i.e.??

OK just a coupleof quick words.
You hate Quixtar/ Amway/ Alticore.... I will not try educate you as I have seen you have NO Brains to be educated about, BUT (tell me something honestly) DID you ever give a decent 100% try on this business????????
Hm... WELL LEMME GUESS....
ABSOLUTELY NOT.... because if you did, you would not be receiving this mail from a 18 year old guy like me. I feel sorry for you buddy. Reading the mails I see you are so adament and crazy that it has blocked your minds for any education or information this company could provide you with.

What so ever it is I hope that people like you never even hear about this exiting business ever in your life because you simply influence and bring misery to thousand's even millions of other people.

Best Regards and Be BROKE !!!!
A BRAND NEW IBO( Independent Business Owner)
Siddhartha Sharma

 
At 1/29/2006 05:34:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

Siddhartha,

Wow! That was quite a post. Gives new meaning to the phrase, 'stream-of-consciousness-rambling'.

I didnt believe i had to go all the way down to get your name.

Go 'all the way down'? To get whose name? Who is this invective directed at? Imran, the author of this blog, or me?

OK just a coupleof quick words.
You hate Quixtar/ Amway/ Alticore.... I will not try educate you as I have seen you have NO Brains to be educated about, BUT (tell me something honestly) DID you ever give a decent 100% try on this business????????
Hm... WELL LEMME GUESS....
ABSOLUTELY NOT....


Boy, so many assumptions there... As far as giving the business a try, if you are referring to Imran, you are so wrong. As far as having 'no brains', thank you for pointing that out. That's what all of us non-IBOs need, an 18-year old dispensing wisdom, telling us we don't have brains. Are you sure you have graduated high-school yet?

 
At 1/30/2006 12:30:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

18 years old and committed to quixtar. I hope you make it buddy, but the odds are against you. By the way, you might be surprised to know that people can and do achieve success in life without quixtar.

 
At 1/30/2006 10:44:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

IBO's are losers. Hey dumbasses you've got to be stupid and brainwashed if you really belive you are an independent buisness owner! You don't own crap and you never will in that satan spawned quixtar. All your doing is making some other fat pricks coke supply plentiful and his wifes mouth full of some other fat pricks cock when he's gone "motivating" other dumbasses like yourself. Why don't you get off your lazy asses and discover something on your own. Rot in hell hipocrits.

 
At 1/31/2006 11:57:00 AM, Anonymous Will said...

I just have 1 question of clarification...

did you mean "Hypocrits"?

 
At 1/31/2006 03:22:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

Ah, Will, you are back?? I thought you would just 'hit and run' ;-).....

So, tell me, do you get the whole "Conlifct Of Interest" thing, or you still don't quite understand it?

What about my challenge to you? I have already met your challenge, so don't you think you should accept mine? Have you downloaded Eric Scheibeler's MERHCANTS OF DECEPTION book yet?

Again, Will, here's something to consider. I was never a Quixtar IBO, I didn't lose any money or time in the business. I have absolutely NO reason to be bitter. Yet I spend my time, trying my best to give prospective and current IBOs complete information about this so-called 'business'. I actually go and attend these so-called 'Open Meetings'. Do I have anything to gain by doing all this? I have absolutely no vested interest, financial or otherwise. And if you think I am doing this, because I am a Democrat/Liberal, think again. I am a conservative, but I am appalled that conservatives and the Republican party apparently support this blood-thirsty corporation. On the other hand, your upline has a vested financial interest in your remaining in the business. Guess who would give you unbiased advice? Guess who would have your best interests at heart?

Yes, Imran was an IBO at one time, but he learnt the TRUTH about this scam, which is why he is trying to warn other IBOs. Scott Larsen also never lost any money in the business, he has no reason to be bitter. Yet he has spent considerable effort and time in doing the research, so that other prospective IBOs can make an informed decision. Joecool, Truth, Xanadustc, all these posters that you see on here and the other critical blogs, have NOTHING to gain to by bashing this business.

Give it some thought. All, these people are asking you is to think for yourself - look at the complete picture, not just the rosy information that your upline is presenting you.

Here's two things to consider.

The much-vaunted system that you sing praises about all the time? I can sum it up in three sentences.

Every single CD/Tape/Seminar/Rally that I have listened to can be summarized in THREE SENTENCES - JOB, NOT GOOD, NO SECURITY. CONVENTIONAL BUSINESS TOO RISKY. ONE BUSINESS GOOD, THE AMWAY/QUIXTAR BUSINESS. ;-)) LOL!! And you repeatedly shell out money every month to listen to this crap over and over and over and over and over again??? Don't you understand that your Upline Diamonds and above are fleecing you? Ask them for their tax returns, see how much of their income comes from the 'system' and how much from Quixtar Bonuses?

On a different tack, let's assume ;-) for a minute that the 'System' does have educational value. Here's a way to use the 'System" more efficiently:

Create MP3 recordings of the so-called training/system CDs. Create MPEG files of the Life-Style Videos created by the Diamonds. Put these recordings on a website. Charge all IBOs a nominal fee of $5/mnth for unlimited access to this website. Give them the freedom to burn their own CDs and use it to listen in their cars when they are traveling. Create a list of recommended books for reading on the website. Let the individual IBOs place requests for the specific books they want to buy for the month. After these requests are placed, the exact same no. of books are ordered by QUIXTAR CORPORATION at a bulk discount rate, and proof of purchase/price is shown to the IBOs. The total purchase price divided by the no. of books becomes the PRICE THAT WILL BE CHARGED TO THE IBOs. A nominal 10% will be added to the price for administrative costs. WEEKLY OPEN MEETINGS? How about all the local IBOs EACH do their own search and submit their proposal to find out which IBO found the cheapest venue. Naturally, the cheapest place becomes the venue for the Open Meeting, with all the IBOs splitting the cost of the venue equally.

Why don't you suggest this to your upline Diamond? What are the odds he will implement it? ZERO! Because the moment they implement this, their profits from the System are completely gone!

Second thing to consider. Let's assume for a moment that you are an unscrupulous guy, and you don't see any problem in making profits from the 'System'. You figure, once you get to Diamond, you will start raking in the money from the 'System' profits. But, what is the guarantee that you will get a cut of the 'System Profits' forever? You are at the mercy of the System Kingpins. THERE IS NO CONTRACT FOR SHARING OF THE SYSTEM INCOME. You will be basically a slave to the System Kingpins. Is that something you look forward to?

Think about it Will. Think hard. I and all these other commenters on here, are trying to save your money and time.

 
At 1/31/2006 03:45:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

Perspective,

Did you get the link for the fake emerald's blog?

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendID=5525401

Sponsored only 8, emerald in less than 2 years, inactive for the last 5 months, but business is growing to diamond. Have fun!

 
At 1/31/2006 05:01:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

Joe,

Thanks, yes, I got your e-maill but his blog is a complete mess. Can't quite figure out where his 'posts' are. The main page is full of links to his 'friends'.

How do you navigate his page?

 
At 1/31/2006 05:31:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

Perceptive,

I just clicked "send message" and I left him a brief message. He responded.

Anyway, he's been fighting with a girl and she's taking him apart right now.

Here's the link:

http://www.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=messageboard.viewThread&entryID=11371643&groupID=100063283&adTopicID=3&Mytoken=9CC63464-A7A3-1073-88BEC56F39CA10837129163

 
At 1/31/2006 06:02:00 PM, Anonymous Will said...

Oh, sorry "perspective" (not a typo) I didn't mean to forget about you, I don't know how I could with how long your ramblings are. Yes, I Understand the definition of "Conflict Of Interest". But here's the fallacy in your "Pastor likes the same girl I do" analogy. Unless you're old school Mormon, you AND the pastor (or his son) can't have the girl at the sametime. Either you do, he or the son does. HOWEVER, I can have success AS WELL as my sponsor. There is no conflict of interest. My sponsor doesn't see a dime from my CDs, he doesn't promote a function to get money from my $90 ticket! I don't promote the system Either to get $$, cause I don't get a dime.
YES, I know that Emeralds and Diamonds DO see money from tools and functions. I don't have a problem with this. They're time and knowledge is valuable. System $ is shown in the plan.

There are websites that show lifestyle videos, for FREE! There Are websites that list suggested books. If you want to order thru Barnes & Noble, go ahead, or you can place it with your tool order and save a little bit.
If the Diamonds can make a little money on it, cause They're the ones placing Bulk orders, so what?

If it costs me $15 at B&N, but it $13 thru Tools, but the Diamonds get it for $11, so they make $2... who cares! They saved me 2 bucks! If it weren't for them, would there even BE the Bulk order?

If I move 1 CD a week - I get it for $7.50... if a Diamond moves 5000 CDs a week, he gets a bulk discount. (aka profit) If there's no value in the CD - Don't Buy it!

The majority of your suggestions are already in place, besides mp3's, but if you're charging for the site isn't That profit? But that would also open up illegal downloading. Plus it would make it too easy for xanadustic to get his hands on SOT ;)
haha.
but anyways, go on ranting, and have fun infiltrating open meetings. you wouldn't catch Anyone off guard at my meeting, any question you would ask, would simply be answered. Seriously what kind of questions do you ask that you think are so tough, and shocking? I'd love to hear how you would catch our speakers off guard. See we have nothing to hide, so you would just get an answer. Oh btw, being a spy at a few open meetings, doesn't show you what the business is like. If you were part of my sponsor's team, actually Doing It... you'd have a slightly different outlook. We have fun, we help people, we don't pressure people to do jack.

 
At 1/31/2006 06:08:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

Hey Joe,

Checked out that thread. That guy is just plain blowing smoke. His claims are just way too outrageous. Especially considering the fact that he can barely construct a proper sentence.

Amazing! Just when I think I have seen it all....these brainwashed IBOs never cease to amaze me...

 
At 1/31/2006 06:15:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

WILL SAID>> Unless you're old school Mormon, you AND the pastor (or his son) can't have the girl at the sametime.

Okay Will,

I had already realized my mistake after I had posted. But too late, I guess. You get to have a little fun at my expense ;-)... So be it.

I kind of figured you would ;-) jump on that mistake... But I am sure you are smart enough to figure out what I meant..... I wasn't trying to suggest that the Pastor was also romantically interested in the girl. What I was driving at was that, he thought she was a good kid and would make a perfect match for his son.

 
At 2/01/2006 10:15:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Whoa, that was a long post.

Guys, Quixtar is a complete scam. Some people just don't get it.

Keep up the good conversation!

Naitch

 
At 2/01/2006 06:22:00 PM, Anonymous Will said...

perspective, I wasn't even trying to make a joke about the pastor wanting the girl. You totally missed my point! Regardless of if HE or his son wanted her too, my Point was, she can only go to one. You and his son can't Both have her. This DOES NOT equate to the business! My sponsor doesn't need me to lose money for him to make it! We can BOTH have success. The better I do, the better He does! When I go platinum - he's sees a 4% check. If I double that volume and go Ruby, his 4% check doubles too! For a guy who supposedly infiltrates a bunch of Open meetings, you sure missed That point! Maybe you should pay attention a little more vs. thinking about how you're going to shock & awe the speaker afterwards.

Follow me yet?, my point was your analogy was crap. I don't have any "conflict of interest" when I suggest to a new guy, he should come to the function, because I don't see a Dime of it! And I don't even bring up Standing order to new people... if they ask about it, I tell them. I just give them CDs to listen to, but after a while and he's not new anymore, I'm not gonna keep giving him CDs, cause I need them for the new people. IF he wants them he can start investing in his business himself. If he doesn't want to buy them... Fine! As long as he still comes to the Opens, trainings, etc. and wants to build it, I'll still work with him. This is the attitude of most IBOs, maybe not All, but Most! It was the attitude of My mentor too.

You weren't even an IBO so You can't speak on this matter other than hearsay! Which is what half of this negative crap online is.

Do you understand that there are bad people in anything? You think because there are 300 bad uplines, that Q* itself is a scam? 300! That would be a lot right? Well that would be less than 1% of IBOs! Heck double it- make it 600 unethical sponsors... so the other 98% of honest IBOs should be bashed and suffer?

Do you think out of 100 cops, 2 might be crooked, or 2 out of 100 judges, or Lawyers!! ha! Should we disban all PD's and Courts?

What about when my college made money selling books? Is that a scam? How about when my uncle got me a job and got an employee referal bonus? Was that a scam? Was That a "Conflict of Interest".

2 suggestions:

1) get a clue

2) get a life!

 
At 2/01/2006 06:31:00 PM, Anonymous Will said...

Ha! - my bad on the math... make that 3,000 bad sponsors and you'd be at 1%! 300 would be 1/10 of 1%!! That puts things in perspective!
How many bad IBOs would it take to start a bad rep? Would 3,000 or 6,000 do it? Well that would be 1-2%. So give the rest of us 338,000 good ones a break!

 
At 2/01/2006 06:43:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

Will says 1% of IBO's are bad. I say more, but ok 1% = 3000 to 6000.

Amway/Quixtar's been around what 50 years? That's 150,000 to 300,000 bad ones and plenty enough to give the company a bad reputation.

 
At 2/01/2006 09:01:00 PM, Blogger perceptive said...

Whoa there, Will, calm down buddy!

And go easy on the condescension, pal! Get a life? Get a clue? Buddy, you are hurting my feelings ;-) now.... Be nice!

Yes, I misunderstood you. But you too missed my point completely! I will explain, but I gotta run for now. Be back, don't worry I haven't forgotten you.

 
At 2/02/2006 11:34:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

The IBO's that help "non-plugged in" downlines are those that are not yet eligible for the tools bonus. Once they reach "profit-sharing direct" status and become eligible, their tune will change.

Naitch

 
At 2/02/2006 12:06:00 PM, Blogger A Friend said...

Emily, I hope you are having fun with this because this guy will never understand.

Sounds like you are doing well and your downline is lucky to have you to counsel and encourage them.

I am fairly new and I am building my business one prospect at a time. I think too many people expect to "Get rich quick" and aren't willing to take the time to "build" a real business. I fully expect to be successful. If I don't succeed it will not be the fault of my upline because they could not be more uplifting and encouraging.

Just keep doing what you are doing and don't let the negative postings bother you. You have already won!

 
At 2/02/2006 12:38:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Quixtar isn't a real business; it's a scam. You're best off leaving now while you still have the chance.

Naitch

 
At 2/03/2006 04:09:00 PM, Blogger Joecool18 said...

Friend,

If you're building it without tools, that's the way to go.

If you're involved with, and involving your downline in tapes/cd's, seminars, etc, yuo;re leading them down the path to financial destruction.

Look at it this way, you are making the diamonds wealthy (with your jobs) by purchasing tools, and in return they give you an endless number if speeches about their experience in the quixtar business.

 
At 2/21/2006 04:02:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

To everyone putting down quixtar, I am 23 years old I have been in the business for 4 months and I have helped 3 downlines go 7500 and I am making a stong six figure icome. You got in the business and expected to get rich quick and not do anything. You probably sat on your ass all day playing PC video games and downloading illegal movies and games and your businnes went nowhere and now your mad and you blame your upline and the whole business on your failure. Grow up and get a life!!

 
At 2/24/2006 07:06:00 PM, Blogger A Friend said...

Anonymous - You have done a great job in a short timeframe. I would appreciate any pointers on getting the level you are. I will put an email I don't use too much here if you want to contact me. I am sure I will get many negative emails too, oh well. gdtkct@msn.com.

 
At 2/24/2006 08:42:00 PM, Blogger Loser said...

I seriously doubt any of us would bother to send you a negative email. We're more interested in open discussion ;) But I don't know...

One thing I do know, you'll get a LOTs of spam. But that's all positive, about opportunities that our fore-fathers fought for ;)

 
At 2/27/2006 11:46:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hey all you hyped up people out there. i just wanted to drop a line or two.


I think that in life you will come across all kinds of perspective and it seems that unfortunately the way that upline pulled influence over you was wrong. I really can't understand how people would have the gall to interfere that greatly in your personal life when this is supposed to be a business. I know that someone at the office would never tell me how to live my llfe and if they did I would still do it my own way.

Yet I have come to realize that in order to truly live life you have to accept that people are entitled to be whoever they choose to be, yet you can always listen to them at a distance or walk away. That has always been and will always be your choice. Just like business decisions. If you choose to try something new, then try it and if you don't like it, walk away but don't do anything just because someone pushes too hard or tries to influence. Isn't that what life is all about? Learning what influences we have had throughout our lives and extracting the inspiration and getting rid of the rest. Yet don't we all find that to be an extreme challenge, until we decide that we, not anyone else makes the decisions to be influenced. So overall if we do allow someone to push our buttons then it is our fault for allowing them in. Sometimes you just gotta walk away.

Yet it seems that the main thing about this business idea is that it is yours, not your uplines. And from the very beginning you can psss up the people that originally got you in. Or even go over their heads. (In all actuality that really doesn't fit the description of a pyramid company that I am familier with. I thought that the levels were very distinct in the pyramid.) Anyway you seem so bright and it is very sad and wrong that someone took their ideas about life and used them in their business. I personally believe that if the diamond above them knew of their words and tactics there would be something to say. Yet overall when it comes down to it every IBO is entitled to do whatever they feel cause it is their business. Yet I really believe that lines were crossed and that you would be platinam and past that by now since you have so much potential. If that happened to me I would have made it a point to pass up my upline with my wife intact.

This is just my opinion based on scanning the blogs here.

I am a very new IBO and I am learning that life is about recognizing where your comfort level is and learning to get beyond yourself and it. The people that I am surrounded by are super encouraging and respectful and I cannot imagine anyone in this business able to survive without integrity and being genuine. That is what this is all about. At least in my eyes. Yet I do realize that if I am not loving all the products and the people around me I would not have joined my team. But with all the research that has gone into every step and the way that the products have genuinely changed my way of living I just can't see why it isn't great. But that is for me.

I think that every place, organization and heck even car lot has the one guy that is constantly selling and using mean tactics. Yet why should the organization or people involved be swayed to stay away due to that one guy. It just doesn't make sense to me, all of these sites, blogs up here damning the company that provides the product and opportunity when really its just the one guy that is a complete ass that they allowed to ruin it for them. Talking to strangers is not for everyone. Seeing the opportunity to grow from doing it, is not for everyone. Yet why put down the support to do it. Why put down the means to an end when it is and always has been completely up to you to make your opportunities in life happen.

This doesn't have to be us and them. Yet we always tend to go there. Why? You will always get out of life what you put into it regardless of how many times you stop. It is always up to you to give other people the power.

Thus I am that IBO that sees how this opportunity makes you strong and forces you to take the risk over and over again and regardless of the outcome continue to smile. And that being said everyone is entitled to their opinion but I know that it is me that will allow it in or not.

 
At 6/05/2006 05:15:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

While in a period of considering whether or not to begin a Quixtar-powered business, I was challenged to expose people to the retail catalog and just take note of orders or interest.

I did, and very MUCH to my surprise, I began with about 500 PV in initial orders.

Folks, there are many people who DO enjoy retailing in a traditional way...(Think Arbonne, Pampered Chef, et al.)

I am creating a group that promoted retailing over sponsoring, product demos over tools and fucntions, and personal consumption is not based on guilt, but on preference...

My upline still helps our group, even though hardly any of us are using Kate, weekly cd's, or major functions...

Retail = volume, and volume = about $500 extra monthly.
I'm thrilled, but I sure won't quit my day job any time soon.

 
At 7/13/2006 01:04:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hi I think all IBO should go visit this website:www.amquix.info you will found out how many marriage had been destroy because of quixstar and other stories. Please new IBO or upline think about it. if you don't beleive it keep doing your business it's your choice.

I was an IBO, my upline told me if your fiance (at that time) don't support you. You will not succesful in this business. Well you are wrong. My wife and I are happy more than ever. I have a friend who is divorce because he spend so many money in quixstart he got evicted from his house have at least 6 people and didn't make any money from it. News IBO who are 18-22 (single) make sure you finish school before jumping in any business.I am positive that they are other business where you can be making a lot of money. I don't think quixstart is the only one.

One last thing I want to say to all of you: be wise when you want to start a business. Because most of the people out there are sharks they are looking for small fish (18-24) who are just starting their life, people who are desperate to make money.

I hope everybody understand what I wrote. If you want I can ask my friend to post a comment on this web site and encourage people to think about quixstar as I told you. If you think quixstar is the business for you go ahead enjoy your life. I pray that what happen to my friend wont happen to you.

Death and life are in the power of the tongue.

 
At 9/14/2006 01:11:00 PM, Blogger Misguided said...

Why fight the critics...They only know what they know. There best thinking has got them to where they are and will get them down that 45 to death plan. Wish them luck and focus on those who need it. I read this stuff to find out why people lose focus and what happened to them to make them think and feel the way they do. I am a IBO and do not want to leave any one with the same taste in there mouth as people have in these blogs. I know the truth and many of us do. Its not about us .... Its about the team... I love my team and looking forward to sharing future success. I am sorry for any of you who have been hurt maybe just because some one did not do what they should of with you. I can not change a opinion or nor shall i try. All i can do is make sure if we ever meet that i don't leave you thinking the same way about me and my team as you do about ones that i think you have delt with in the past. Every one has a right to there opinion but no one ever feels any one else's might be right. Maybe it is maybe it is not. I guess we all have to find our own path and live with our results. (what ever that may be) I do get sick of hearing people cry too that never commited to business. But i think us that are changing our lives and the peoples lives around us need to take this negative and turn it into a positive and change things that some people are doing that seems to hurt other people. So lets read and learn and prepare to better ourselves for tomorrow and help that next person accomplish there dreams and goals. Again i am sorry for you bad experiences but the only thing i can offer in return is to try and make sure people on my team don't feel the same way. Of cousre i am not perfect and never pretend to be and i am sure people on my team might walk away and have to find some self justification for there actions and that is ok too. As long as i did what i could to maybe help them better there life.

 
At 9/21/2006 01:56:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Misguided do you hear yourself? "It's not about me, it's about the team"?

Why the hell did you get into AmQuix anyway? From what you're saying you got into it to make other people money.

You talk about people crying because they failed since they never committed to the "business".
If it's so easy then why do only .0001% make the diamond level?

Why is it only 1 in 10,000 make it there and why is it in these "plan booklets" that fact is in such small print. Why isn't that brought to light when you're prospecting someone?

Oh yeah, because you only present half truths and never present the whole story. You only say what you're taught to say by the brilliant minds of "diamonds" LOL!

Who cares if you don't represent the whole truth to a complete stranger, friend of family member as long as you're making money right?

What a great, ethical business you have. If it's so great why is it people NEVER come out and say "I'm in Quixtar"? Why do they candy coat by saying shit like "I have a great business opportunity" or "I just started my own online business"?

NEWS FLASH: You DON'T have your own business. Business owners are not told what to do, like attend meetings, seminar and rallies or read books and listen to tapes.
Business owners make their own decisions IBO'S DO NOT MAKE THEIR OWN DECISIONS. Of course if they do they're labeled as losers by their upline. What a great business, maybe next time I'm "prospected I'll run right out and join"

NO THANK YOU!
BIG DOG

 
At 1/01/2007 01:25:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

a

 
At 1/01/2007 01:36:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Never do anything for the 1st time without checking upline...
Its a privilege to work at the functions (sucker) and if you don't work for free then you are a bad example...

The only thing you will get being associated with wwdb is GUILT and an org looking for FREE LABOR (Slavery)while they soak their pockets with TOOL MONEY

 
At 2/28/2007 01:27:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I am 99.9 percent sure, Emily is a republican.

 
At 5/04/2007 09:20:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I was recently approached to join up and become an IBO - no thanks!
I choose not to drink the Kool-aid.
I was told that it would cost ME about $50/month for them to maintain MY website that they help me set up. WHAT!!! I can go out and get a website creator cd for $30 and never have to have anyone ever help me maintain MY website.
Do the math - if there are 10,000 people (number use just for an example) having there websites maintained for $50/month that is only 6 million dollars a year for them. Sounds right to me. That's 6 million for just having you along for the ride. Enjoy the ride.

 
At 5/23/2007 09:45:00 AM, Blogger Erik said...

Yada yada yada…… blame blame blame…. At some point each of us will realize we are responsible for our own actions. Yes IBO’s have rules so does McDonalds and Subway I am sure they are evil in some way too. Yes there are mentors that at time are pushy… the highly successful coaches in sports are also called pushy and demanding. If you want success you imitate success. Read a few leadership and success books you will find the same traits and teachings from the authors of these books. I’m sure most have heard of “Power of Positive Thinking” or “success through a positive mental attitude” how about “think and grow rich”. All these books were written before MLM “scams” the have had long term success because truth does not fade. Oh yeah there’s this crazy “new” book called “The Secret” it just repeats everything the other books already said.
Stay Focused
Sell Yourself
Tell Others
Maybe its just me but I see a pattern. 2% of the people control 90% of money in the world. 98% of the people work for someone else… Hmmm

 

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