Monday, March 14, 2005

Developer of BWW websites

Ok I'm bit curious about Dan Hollings. I picked my curiosity from some of his edits on Quixtar entry in Wikipedia.

In MLM Survivor, Mr. Dan Hollings claims that he developed bww IBO sites. Then they both had some problems:
During 2001 through 2002, IBO sites were provided for 10.50 a month of which about 5.00 was cost and the balance was profit to BWW. To my knowledge, profits were kept by BWW and not distributed back downline. For round numbers, they averaged about 10,000 IBO site subscribers per month through 2002 at $10.50 per month. This was a US only tool. Do the math.

Not being happy with having to pay the creator, copyright holder, developer and provider... BWW orchestrated an elaborate plan to copy and reengineer my system which they had access to by license. Result? In 2003 through 2004 they grossed over $2,100,000 (that's over 2 million dollars) from IBO sites and paid nothing to me. A new provider did the 'handy work' and charged BWW about a buck and a quarter a site per month to service the replicated system.
And now he is working with Eric S, author of Merchants of Deception in a website Lets get the word out.

Now I have some questions.
  1. What if BWW paid him as he demanded? Would he have any problem with them?
  2. What if he had some problems regarding payment with Eric Scheibeler? Will he start working against him as well?
  3. How much he was charging BWW? Was it for initial design, hours he worked or a residual income / IBO site?
Seems to me that he is just a business person who is unhappy with BWW about some payment issues. I dunno. I'm just too skeptical :) Seriously, I don't want any one exploiting folks like Eric Scheibeler.

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8 Comments:

At 3/22/2005 10:46:00 AM, Blogger matt said...

Mr. Hollings is an internet and network marketing consultant and yes, he holds the federal copyright certificate on an IBO site system that was licensed to BWW during 2001-2002. I do not know the precise licensing arrangement, but I would expect a monthly fee per user as is common practice for such agreements, especially since Mr Hollings not only provided the system but also maintained it and provided customer support.

I'll try to answer your questions, because unfortunately I believe Mr Hollings has been silenced in a recent settlement over a lawsuit that resulted when BWW apparently infringed his copyright and replicated the system. I know a little bit about this having worked with Mr Hollings in a previous company in 2000 and having experienced how BWW operated.

1. What if BWW paid him as he demanded? Would he have any problem with them?

Well yes and no. Mr Hollings created and owned the IBO site system, lock-stock-and-barrel so if they paid him his licensing fee he would have probably been ok with that, but the second issue is BWW allegedly replicated his copyright and trade secrets without permission that clouds ownership issues in the marketplace. I guess it's like if someone broke into your garage and stole the blueprints to a custom designed car you had built, then went out and started selling that car in the marketplace. Even if the thieve in this example paid you later (after they were caught) you'd still be mad as hell because they exploited your "design" for profit in the marketplace and clouded the ownership issue. And what if their stolen replica was inferior (after all it was a hacked copy), it's just bad business... plain and simple. My conjecture is that BWW never paid Mr Hollings one dime after the system was stolen and he was forced to fight a long legal battle. I do know that his company went out of business as a result. I personally knew some of the programmers and designers and it was devastating to see the ramifications of this on all their families.

2. What if he had some problems regarding payment with Eric Scheibeler?
Will he start working against him as well?

I do not know Eric Scheibeler, nor the arrangement on "Let's Get The Word Out" http://www.letsgetthewordout.com but I do know that it is associated with a non-profit consumer group called Pyramid Scheme Alert. You can tell a lot from reading the site and a Yahoo News article listed at FURL - http://www.furl.net/members/LGTWO/Business

This project has nothing to do with Mr Holling's lawsuit with Bill Britt and BWW (which I heard is now calling themselves "Business Worldwide" instead of "Britt Worldwide"), it has everything to do with the book "Merchants of Deception" http://wwwmerchantsofdeception.com

Dan Hollings has many clients and Scheibeler seems to be one of them. All I can say on that subject is that Scheibeler picked one hell of an internet marketing "guru" to promote his project.

But to answer your question, what would anybody do if their client or employer did not pay them for their services? I suspect Mr Hollings would stop working if a client did not pay him his earn fees. Wouldn't you? But I do not suspect Mr Scheibeler plans to have programmers climb in Mr Hollings window at night, nab the copyright "WordyCause" system blueprints and rake in millions by selling it in the open market without compensation Mr. Hollings. That's illegal.

3. How much he was charging BWW? Was it for initial design,
hours he worked or a residual income / IBO site?

Mr Hollings has sold this very IBO site system to many other companies and clients. In other arrangements, his typical licensing agreement charges a small set-up fee for customizations then a monthly fee based on the number of subscribers. I'm not sure of how the BWW agreement was structured, but that is my guess.

In the end, what's important to note is that all Mr Hollings did was offer his services and system to Britt World wide. What it appears Mr Britt did was in my book, called theft. The funny thing is this... you can steal a system blueprint but you cannot steal someone's knowledge and expertise. Had Bill Britt been smart, he would have fired all the clowns in his internet department that did this stupid thing and paid Dan Hollings a consulting fee to help him and his IBO members online.

Bill Britt, other diamonds, and Quixtar itself seem more focused on crazy ideas like Google Bombing, bogus blogs, phony news sites, stealing systems, sexual harassment and deception in general. Wake up Bill and smell the coffee!


Matt H

 
At 3/22/2005 10:24:00 PM, Blogger Loser said...

Thanks Matt.

No I know what BWW did. It was WRONG. I never said other wise? I don't know why u think I am taking their side?

Point is not BWW vs Hollings.

Point is why hollings is against BWW. Is it BWW abuse of IBOs or revenge?

I'll ask some more questions:

1) Mr. Hollings knew how much BWW made of those sites before he had a problem with them?

2) Mr. Hollings is pretty critical of BWW practices now. Was he then?

That site SUCKED. It was so not worth $10 monthly fee!!!! What was in that site, a hardcoded password and email responder. That's it? And out of that $10, how much was he taking?

I'll pull up the lawsuit from pacer and publish it.

And thanks for the cool comment. No flames. Good to talk to ;)

 
At 3/23/2005 10:50:00 PM, Blogger matt said...

You're really not understanding Dan Hollings or this BWW issue. Dan is
a creative web developer with a true focus on helping the network
marketer in the street. If anyone can design an online web system
that'll produce results, it's Dan. Problem is, with some clients (and
I learned this in the trenches) they insist on doing it "their" way.
That's why some people thought the sites sucked. Truth is, even Dan
thought they sucked... WHY? Because BWW restricted Dan from building
an IBO Site like he recommended. (See Dan's recommendations later in my
post).

For starters, BWW (and Quixtar) insisted on a password requirement for
visitors to get in. On the stupid scale, that ranks up there as a big
10. You've just eliminated 100% of any marketing a BWW IBO might want
to do to get traffic to their site. Then if you got inside (because
you're the site owners grandmother or something) it was nothing but a
big pitch about the business opportunity. All the content was written
by BWW of course. I remember that BWW would not even let the site owner
write a personal bio about themself... what's up with that?

It's been a while since I was inside that system, but I do recall that
under the restrictions that Dan had to follow, he managed to pull off
something far better than most developers could have done. The proof
was in the pudding, if they didn't like it why didn't they go out and
have a new developer create something different? Instead, best I can
tell, they hired some group of thieving geeks to replicate the thing with
one goal: to cut Dan out of the money. Shall we say "GREED"?

I'm sure Hollings knew how much BWW was making and as long as BWW paid
Hollings based on their agreement all would be OK, that's fair and
respectable. But to nab something that's not yours and go rake in
millions without paying the rightful owner... that's the stuff
lawsuits are made of. I'm sure Dan does not mind if BWW or any client
makes a profit, but you can't do it off Dan's proprietary stuff without
paying him his license fee. I think if BWW had gone out and done their
own thing, rather than infringe on trade secrets and copyrights, there
would have been no challenges. That's my opinion.

Dan is critical when somethings foul. Most of us are (or should be).
But my view on Dan is that he offers constructive criticism. I said it
in my first post and I'll say it again... Had Bill Britt been smart, he
would have fired all the clowns in his internet department that did
this stupid thing and paid Dan Hollings a consulting fee to help him
and his IBO members online. And now that I see
href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_bomb">Quixtar "Google
Bombing"
I think Quixtar should hire Dan Hollings too. One things
for sure, their current strategy is in the dumpster.

From the things I've read by Dan Hollings, he's a no punches pulled,
straight shooter about the problems with some MLMs and in particular
the problems with their approach to internet marketing and web systems.
For some insight, read this article I copy pasted (below) from a
syndication site that has published a few things by Dan (re-print
rights are allowed, so we're cool). You'll see readily that Dan does
care about IBOs and he does know his stuff.

ARTICLE BELOW BY DAN HOLLINGS -----

WHO TOOK THE "NETWORKING" OUT OF NETWORK MARKETING?
Why Distributor Web Sites Don't Work.

by Dan Hollings
href="http://DanHollings.com">http://DanHollings.com
Copyright 2005

This topic effects millions of independent business owners (IBOs or
distributors as they are called), and unfortunately often in a negative
way. Maybe this article can help.

Buckle-up, the realities in this article will certainly throw many off
your seat.

HOW COULD SO MANY GET IT SO WRONG?

Network Marketing online has so missed the mark, one wonders how so
many people and so many companies could have it so wrong. Typically
one does the obvious when seeking solutions that work online; they
follow the leaders. It makes sense to observe companies like Amazon,
Netflix, or Google and adapt winning concepts. But not MLM companies,
they march to a different drummer and relentlessly continue to push a
square-wheel uphill.

The examples I've studied are far too many to cover in one article, but
let's look at a few.

Network marketing was built on the principle that one tries the product
first, they fall in love with the benefits, and they find themselves
wanting to tell other people about it (ie: word-of-mouth). However, in
network marketing you earn money as you tell your product story with
others. Simple.

LEFT TURN, WRONG ROAD

Suddenly, the internet was born and MLM has great expectations. Instead
of "networking" and "sharing the product", we get the biggest left turn
in marketing that anyone could imagine. The age of super hype, lead
generation, mass mailings, recruit & forget, and bad PR is upon us.
When the biggest company, Amway, makes their "Quixtar" entry in 1999,
what was already on a bad track seemed to derail.

And today? On virtually every distributor site (I've evaluated 115+) we
see "BUSINESS OPPORTUNITY", "MAKE MONEY", "IT'S SO EASY ANYBODY CAN DO
IT"... it's everywhere. On some, it's hard to determine what the
product is. If you're lucky enough to figure it out, guess what hurdle
comes next?

MLM companies force new customers to "join first" and become a
member/distributor BEFORE they've purchased their first product. Can
you imagine that offline? Jump in the Chevy and head up to your
grocery store. Buy a bar of soap. Next go to the checkout and imagine
them forcing you to become a soap salesman BEFORE you can checkout. It
gets worse, some sites require the customer obtain a secret passcode
just to look at the soap! Jeff Bezos, would be librarian today if he
had put a "password only" sign on Amazon.com.

YOU GET WHAT YOU ADVERTISE FOR...

Here's the sad truth: with few exceptions, no one in network marketing
is sustaining an profitable online business where products are sold
through the distributor sites to regular customers secured by common
online marketing techniques. In fact, I know of no example of a network
marketer that makes more money selling product than he spends on the
site itself. Whoa, you might want to re-read that one.

In a nutshell, I'm saying product sales aren't happening independently
of recruiting people into the business. And unfortunately, because of
the hype about "make money fast" and "how anyone can do it", the type
of recruits one gets, are often not good candidates for running their
own business. Advertise for people that can make money "doing nothing"
and you'll attract recruits that "do nothing."

NO SALES NO TRAINING

You immediately wonder why such a failed system would endure? Perhaps
the companies had initial high hopes of online product sales, but
settled for the revenue generated by selling the sites as a "tool". If
10,000 distributors pay $10 a month on a square-wheel vehicle and never
complain, that's $100,000 a month revenue.

Another fatal flaw is internet training. It is tradition that an MLM
company does not do "marketing" training, that's left to experienced
distributors. The company sets guidelines, but hands-on training is
distributor to distributor.

This would be fine, but online marketing came about rather abruptly and
'old-school' MLM trainers did not keep pace. The industry at-large shot
an arrow into cyberspace only to miss the target. Instead, they hit the
distributors right in the wallet. Blind leading the blind? Yes.

To think that Amazon.com would flourish in the pure brilliance of a
MLM-like affiliate program starting at zero while the biggest of the
big, Quixtar slaps visitor password requirements on their IBO sites is
dumbfounding.

LET'S BUY SOME SOAP

Let me take your hand as we try to buy some soap at Quixtar. If you
start at an IBO site (and there are many versions based on the Quixtar
group you stumble upon) you'll eventually find a link to transfer from
the IBO's site over to Quixtar. It's the route any IBO would want you
to take, because otherwise you do not know the IBO's "ID number" and
any purchase you make won't get credited to the "IBO" you're now
"tagged" to.

In my example, there were some 9 clicks before I willingly left the
"business pitch area" to search for my soap. Now we're at the
Quixtar.com shopping site itself, where after more pitches on "the
business" even me (an experienced web guy) had to click another dozen
times as I browsed for their famous 'LOC' soap products. I finally gave
up feeling like I was lost in Windsor Castle. Next I resorted to a
search using their search box. I typed in LOC and was promptly dumped
on their "Sun Block in a Stick" page, feeling like a stick in the mud I
decided to try a Google search for LOC and ended up on an "Amway" site
that had all the LOC soap products but no check-out button at all. I
could not buy. Great, back to Quixtar...

I returned to Quixtar, thinking that maybe it was my fault because I
should have searched for L.O.C. rather than LOC and sure enough I found
the soap: 27 different varieties. I decide to explore the "L.O.C. Plus
Kitchen Cleaner" (it runs $30.65, or about what my maid service runs).
They offered a comparison showing how you can take the Quixtar L.O.C.
concentrate and make 32 bottles of cleaner out of it (I assume by
adding water) and save 10% over the cost of "Formula 409". Boy, that
sounded like fun, so I'm off to checkout... only to find what looked
like a job application form. Over 30 text boxes, pull down menus,
checkboxes, password prompts, and referring IDs inputs. 13 input
fields alone covered my phone number (made me feel like they planned to
call me). I'm starting to think maybe "Formula 409" isn't as
concentrated, but if I boiled it down for 20 minutes it might thicken
up and in the end be good enough.

I scooted over to Froogle and had my "Formula 409" purchased within 5
minutes.

NOTE: for those that wish to check-out my observations in the above
example, I started by search for a Quixtar IBO site on google. That
alone was very challenging, but I found a few (this one comes from a
group known as BWW or Bill Britt Worldwide):
href="http://www.bww.com/PBP/Templates/Template7/
FlashHome.aspx?%20siteid=615f38defb214135a4a895830153ddc4&
DetFlash=true">http://www.bww.com/PBP/Templates/Template7/
FlashHome.aspx?
siteid=615f38defb214135a4a895830153ddc4&DetFlash=true
(The above
web address may truncate it is so long)

Don't you love that web address, I can see it on a business card
already.

Next, you'll need to get in. Try it yourself. If you wish to time the
process, you won't need a stop watch, an hourglass will do. You're on
your own from there.

THE 13 DUMBEST THINGS ABOUT DISTRIBUTOR WEB SITES

OK, let's cut to the chase. Regardless of what you call them: IBO
sites, distributor sites, replicating sites, associate sites, MLM sites
or personal sites, here are what I call the 13 dumbest things:


1) Most sites mix the business opportunity
with the product (often the opportunity
dominates the site).

2) Most sites force membership upon potential
customers who merely want to buy or try a
product.

3) Site content is typically full of hype,
especially in the opportunity content areas.

4) There is little ability for a distributor
to differentiate his site from another
replicated site.

5) There is often no way to build an opt-in
list (a newsletter for example)

6) There is no forethought into designing the
site for online marketing campaigns, that is,
most sites are built with the expectation
that visitors all enter from the home page
and find their way. For example, if the site
owner wanted to do a pay-per-click search
engine listing, the site will likely not
offer a good "landing page" to send visitors
to.

7) Inadequate visitor or campaign tracking
tools. Simple hit counters don't really help
a site owner evaluate traffic campaigns.

8) Crazy URLs (especially web address links
for interior pages of the site) are often
three miles long. Trying to send a customer
to any page other than the home page is a
real challenge for many networkers. And if
you do this, in some cases the site does not
track the sale to you for proper
compensation.

9) OK, sorry to burst your bubble, but those
10 minute MLM flash movies with exploding
letters and the driving music are not
increasing popcorn sales much less your
product sales. 10) Purchasing opportunity
leads is one of the worst ways to get traffic
to your site.

11) Auto-responders? In most cases you
"Ought-o-forget'em"

12) A site has little use unless you get
proper training in how to integrate it into
your online and offline business and you
learn how to generate targeted traffic
(preferably, customer traffic).

13) If your site requires a password for
visitors and customers to enter, you may as
well cancel it now. there are far better uses
for that money and no store owner has ever
succeeded by locking customers out.


WHAT'S WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE

What better place is there to network than on the largest network in
the world: the internet. It's a world of blogging, photo sharing,
social systems, discussion groups and more, all classified by the tags
of Technorati to the keywords of Google. Yet, no one is "networking"
in a true sense, in the online realm of network marketing. Sadly, most
distributors are blundering and wondering.

Compliancy issues are looming over the industry as well. The FTC,
consumer groups like Pyramid Scheme Alert (
href="http://www.pyramidschemealert.org/">http://
www.pyramidschemealert.org/
), and grassroots movements like "Let's
Get The Word Out" (
href="http://www.letsgetthewordout.com">http://
www.letsgetthewordout.com
) are applying pressure on companies and
the industry at large to make changes. The "tools" part of the
business has always been controversial and as Dateline NBC exposed in
their year long investigation (
href="http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4375477/">http://www.msnbc.msn.com/
id/4375477/
), it's not a pretty picture.

Changes are needed and changes will come. A shining light in the
"tools" fog may present itself by the summer of 2005 from a Salt Lake
city company, Brookline Technologies, Inc. They are already immersed in
the industry as an enterprise level genealogy or eCommerce/commission
tracking company for global network marketing companies. They plan to
release a suite of tools, starting with distributor web sites that will
target compliancy issues, the existing pitfalls, and lack of internet
training as discussed in this article. Yes, I've got a whip under their
tail and a carrot in front of their nose. Unfortunately however, no
solution trickles down to the street-level MLM'er unless their
particular network marketing company adopts such a change. Perhaps
they'll change on their own, perhaps they'll seek outside assistance,
but change they must.

HEAR'S A TIP

If you're a network marketer, the onus is on you to help your company
understand what it is you need. You might not understand all the
reasons your business is not flourishing online, but a quick look at
your bank account is all the evidence you need to prove it is not. I
would hope that your upline or your company will not point the finger
back at you or suggest that the internet is not a worthwhile way to
build your business (you know, your site is mostly just for ordering or
to send friends to), because it's not true. Online marketing does not
replace offline; it complements it, but to scuttle the internet as NOT
a viable way to find customers and sell product is, I have to say it:
"stupid".

It costs far more than a $30 a year registration fee to be a
distributor or IBO. An IBO site alone will average another $150 a
year. Then the optional (or required) books, tapes, seminars, rallies,
and voice mail systems get layered on top. Add your phone bill, office
expenses, gas for your car, and the list goes on. If you cannot clear
$1,000 a year in profits, you're in the hole. If your spouse finds
out, you're also in the doghouse. But some will say, "I'm building a
downline, I've already got 5 in my group, no business is profitable in
the early years, and my upline already drives a gold plated Schwinn,
yada yada yada."

Folks, there are many things you can do, online and off to make $1,000
or more in the first year and grow, if you're still spending more money
than you're making after a year in the MLM business, maybe you're
peddling the wrong bike?

If you truly believe in your product or service and it has brought
benefits to you and your family; your enthusiasm and your personal
story is a "marketing machine" waiting to happen. You need good tools,
a good web site, and continuing training on how to make it all work. If
you're not getting that, it's time to kick, scream, shout and rattle
some cages. Other industries have figured it out, why not network
marketing?

ABOUT THE AUTHOR: Dan Hollings is a former university instructor who
has achieved the highest ranks in Network Marketing. He is a formidable
web technologist, systems developer, internet marketing 'guru', and
consultant. As an advocate of positive business change in the MLM
industry, he heads projects like "Let's Get The Word Out"
href="http://www.letsgetthewordout.com">http://
www.letsgetthewordout.com
- Hundreds of thousands of distributors,
dozens of MLM companies, trainers & authors have benefited from Dan
Hollings' consultation, trainings and diverse web systems.
BrooklineTechnologies.com provides web solutions based on Mr Hollings
recommendations.

This article is reprinted with permission from www.WritingCareer.com

A shorter online version of this same article is at:
href="http://SearchWarp.com/swa6393.htm">http://SearchWarp.com/
swa6393.htm

 
At 11/01/2006 03:53:00 PM, Blogger nandish said...

i dont know who u r wht u do but let me tell u something u r pathetic cause quixtar is the best opportunity tht you can get so first of all i dont think u know anything about quixtar and second of all just stop making stupid comments about it

 
At 11/01/2006 03:55:00 PM, Blogger nandish said...

you plp suck ass quixtar doesnt suck

 
At 11/01/2006 03:57:00 PM, Blogger nandish said...

cause you r a bunch of loosers who couldnt stand hard work and now u blame the corporation for tht u r nothing but some fools

 
At 11/01/2006 04:43:00 PM, Blogger Loser said...

just stop making stupid comments about it

And you appear to be a genius by your comments.

;)

 
At 5/26/2011 08:40:00 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dan,

Bottom line Bill Britt makes more money than you. He's older than you. He's wiser than you.

Amway / Quixtar is the best opportunity on the planet.

Anyone who disagress doesn't know chocolate from horse shit.

Regards,
IBO (Damn proud of being one)

 

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